WWE RAW Discussion Thread 2019

[Guest HH-Evolution]

You probably did, Zack....you probably did. ;D

[Kam 243]

YAY! It's Corbin vs Rollins for the title at Super Showdown :partysign:

 

I know they don't need to give anything worthwhile away as its a Saudi show and they have Goldberg/Taker and Triple h/Orton...but it doesn't help Raw much. They told us they would listen due to the ratings/crowd apathy...it doesn't feel like they are.

[Zack T 171]

It seems possible that Brock will cash in at Saudi Arabia. Seth vs Corbin seems really underwhelming. The Saudi's are forcing WWE to market this as "Equal to or better than WrestleMania!" and I suspect they may be demanding a cash in to add to the excitement.

[Zack T 171]

Didn't watch Raw, I got myself confused and thought NXT Takeover was this weekend and then I realized I missed it, so I've been catching up on NXT instead and will watch Takeover tonight.

 

But I've read Raw, and wtf.

 

Opening segment is fine, whatever. Results said that Roman got a mixed reaction though. I hadn't heard mixed reactions too much for him yet, are we back to the full on boo's for him yet?

 

This could be the results having a typo, but the backstage segment was reported as having Billie Kay saying she was going to prepare for her match, but later it was Peyton who actually wrestled. Did anyone pay enough attention to tell me if that's how it actually happened, or if the results I read just typed it wrong?

 

On paper, the Lacey Evans/Charlotte stuff didn't sound too bad. I honestly mostly skip over reading the details of the matches themselves, I am more concerned with the dialogue. Apparently though the match was REALLY BAD. Kind of surprises me. I mean, Lacey still has a ways to go but she hadn't had any awful matches in NXT. At worst, she was just forgettable. Odd.

 

Something that makes 0 sense to me is the way Nikki Cross is acting. It seems like they've really reigned in her crazy (Which is fine, that probably needed to be toned down ever so slightly anyway, her constant "Want to play with me?" stuff was really annoying), but now she's making normal friends with Alexa Bliss and trying to calm her down/stop her from beating down people? That's not Nikki Cross at all.

 

Seth gets 2 in ring segments, ok...well, as we suspected, no cash in. Definitely could have, Brock destroyed him. But he yells "FRIDAY" and the obvious continues to happen. Saudi Arabia wanted a big moment, so we're gonna get a cash in and probably a new champion. Maybe even 2 new champions, if Baron Corbin wins!

 

Yay Ricochet wins in the rubber match with Cesaro...except it was another random roll up pin. Fantastic. More 50/50 booking. Cesaro wins over Ricochet when Ricochet is all beat up from money in the bank but he won definitively with the Neutralizer, while Ricochet only beats Cesaro with lucky out of no where pins. Way to make Ricochet look strong.

 

The R-Truth hiding on a table under the ring spot looks hilarious though. I gotta give them credit, they're doing fun stuff with the 24/7 title.

 

I did like the Fireflies Fun House though. I watch those on YouTube.

 

Way to cut off the Undertaker's speech...

 

 

 

Things that I've been wondering today:

 

Where the heck are Ryder/Hawkins? It's been 3 weeks or so since we've seen them do more than a quick backstage appearance.

 

Where the heck are the Viking Raiders? Same thing. They show up, dominate for a couple weeks, and now they're gone again. Really pisses me off that they call them up, change their names, mess up the plans that were made for them in NXT, and now they're not even being used. GREAT JOB VINCE.

 

Bobby Roode did a character change and turns in to Robert Roode last month, beats Ricochet, then gets left out of the MITB match in favor of Ricochet and has a chance to take his spot if he beats Ricochet but of course he doesn't cause 50/50 booking. Then he disappears from TV until the 24/7 title is revealed, wins it from Titus O'Neil, loses it the same night to R-Truth by having his head bounced off a car (That'd have barely phased a wrestler in a proper last man standing type of match) and we haven't seen him since, I don't think. Great way to establish his new gimmick...

 

Why aren't titles being featured worth crap right now? Specifically the Raw/Smackdown Tag titles, the Smackdown Women's title (Bayley has barely been on TV since winning the SD Women's title), the IC title, and the US title are all being forgotten about. I can give a little bit of a pass to the US title cause it did have a US title match at MITB and Rey's injury kind've messed things up some and they did put the title back on Joe on Raw...but Finn had been off TV since MITB (Fair enough too, he might've needed time to heal from those vicious ladder bumps). Bryan/Rowan lost a meaningless non-title PPV match to the Usos and that's pretty much all they've done since winning the tag titles a month ago. But even still, they're largely after thoughts right now.

 

Speaking of titles, the Women's Tag Titles are already floundering. While the IIconics are on TV each week, the competition in that division is nonexistent. Sasha/Bayley are split up immediately after losing the titles, Nia is out injured so no more Nia/Tamina, Beth is retired so no more Beth/Natalya, Mickie is injured so no more Mickie/Alexa, Carmella and Naomi apparently only were a team for the Elimination Chamber match and aren't teaming anymore, the Riott Squad was broken up with Liv Morgan moving to Smackdown and Ruby is injured and Sarah Logan may get put with the Viking Raiders since she's married to one of them anyway.

 

So who's left? Well there still are some teams. Looks like Alexa Bliss is latching on to Nikki Cross now, and we still have Fire & Desire (Mandy/Sonya) and the...Kubuki...Warriors...what a terrible name. But Alexa is challenging Bayley for the SD Women's title so at the moment, there seems to be no indication that her and Cross will challenge for the Women's Tag titles and that's kind of a heel vs heel match anyway. Same problem for Mandy/Deville, they're not gonna do that cause it's heel vs heel. So that just leaves the Kubuki Warriors, who were seemingly being positioned to be the next challengers but Asuka and Kairi Sane have mysteriously vanished from TV for the last 3 weeks or so as well, maybe longer.

 

So basically we've got Peyton and Billie running around with title belts and no challengers, losing non-title matches to Becky/Cross but nothing comes of it and it's forgotten about the next week. The Women's tag division already looks dead in the water :| I think the women's division does need secondary titles, but there's just not any effort being put in to give the women's tag division an actual identity. I think a secondary singles Women title would've been a better idea. As it currently is, if you're in the women's division and you're not feuding for a title, you basically have nothing going on unless you happen to be the sidekick for someone who is involved in the title picture. Giving them a Women's TV title or something like that, that might help a little bit. But who knows.

[Kam 243]

This could be the results having a typo, but the backstage segment was reported as having Billie Kay saying she was going to prepare for her match, but later it was Peyton who actually wrestled. Did anyone pay enough attention to tell me if that's how it actually happened, or if the results I read just typed it wrong?

It was Peyton that said it.

 

When they said Brock would be cashing in on Raw I thought they wouldn't be stupid enough to push fans to watch the show (after last weeks terrible ratings)...just to turnaround and say, nope, Friday. How silly did Brock look too? Seth was down, he could have just taken the title, there was no reason for him to say Friday - why would he want to go to Saudi to get the title when he can just take it there.

 

We constantly hear about how difficult it is for WWE to fill the amount of programming time they have to do each week - yet they miss out so much of the roster. As you said @Zack T - why aren't they pushing Roode, Viking Raiders etc - they've got the time for it. It might even mean we don't need to see the same matches each week!

 

I'm already sick of Lars and him squashing the Lucha House Party each week...

 

Good point about Nikki Cross too - the best thing about her character was how unpredictable she is - she still does that crazy run to the ring in her entrance, but that seems to go against what we see in her backstage segments where she seems pretty calm/collected.

 

As interesting as the Bray stuff is...I have zero faith in WWE booking him any better than he was before.

 

I also thought it was weird Rey just handing the title over to Samoa Joe - when was the last time the champion just forfeited the title back to the former champion? I thought we'd get some kind of tournament at least.

[Mr.Windham29 35]

So Charlotte is supposed the be the best wrestler in the world but didn't know what to when Lacey was botching, proved that Charlotte is only good when her opponent knows how to work.

[Zack T 171]

Yea I'm surprised they'd have Rey hand the US title back to Joe. That is the first time I can remember that ever happening. But I dunno, it is different to do it that way. Still, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense for Rey to hand the title over to a guy who has attacked him brutally, injured him, even threatened his son.

 

Charlotte is probably the least good out of the WWE's 4 horsewomen, but she's still quite good, especially with the right people. But if Lacey was the one botching all over the place, I'd place more of the blame on her. I mean yea Charlotte maybe could've done more to salvage it, I don't know for sure as I didn't watch the match myself. But if the botches appear to be Lacey's fault, I'd blame her more than Charlotte.

[Kam 243]

[GALLERY=media, 536][/GALLERY]

 

Still remember this from the Rumble :roflmao: It seems like they're happy to push Lacey like crazy...but not many of the other NXT stars who should have deserved a decent shot.

[Zack T 171]

It's not unusual for WWE to push someone hard who may have a look they like or portray a gimmick really well, and Lacey has a good look and owns her gimmick. That oftentimes will cause the WWE to push someone beyond their wrestling ability and either they grow and improve (Braun Strowman) or they don't and they fizzle out (Ezekial Jackson).

[Kam 243]

I should be happy that The Revival are champs again...but I'm just feeling meh!

 

We got Lars vs Lucha House Party again - I wonder if we'll be lucky enough to see that again next week...

 

Baron's still getting title shots :sleep:

[Zack T 171]

Yea, I want to be happier about the Revival regaining the tag titles, but given the way they've been treated lately I don't have high hopes for them being portrayed as serious champions. I kind of expect them to retain against Hawkins/Ryder, then the Usos, then get smashed by the Viking Raiders.

[Ogmore 28]

So Charlotte is supposed the be the best wrestler in the world but didn't know what to when Lacey was botching, proved that Charlotte is only good when her opponent knows how to work.

I think a lot of is just a lack of chemistry and compatibility though between the two. Taker and Goldberg knew each other for years, seemed to actually get on well together, and are both incredibly talented, but look what a mess that turned out to be in Saudi Arabia.

 

The most amazing female wrestler at the moment who handles botches well is Asuka and I wish she'd get moved to RAW where she'd be useful. She needs more screen time.

[Zack T 171]

Goldberg seems to have knocked himself out or gotten concussed during the match with Undertaker. Before that, it was going pretty good. But around the time he rams into the turnbuckle post, it all falls apart.

[Ogmore 28]

@Zack T Yeah, I get all that, but Taker didn't recover/hide it well that things had gone south. I mean if Charlotte Flair is expected to anticipate and make up for Lacey Evan's botches, surely a legend like Taker should be held up to the same standard. I'm not a massive fan of Charlotte's, but I don't get the hate. Really, I think Taker did what he could but he looked disgruntled and aggravated with the whole thing. I don't know. I just don't see much of a difference. The truth is that very few wrestlers handle/recover botches and unplanned injuries well. It takes the right combo of people too.

[Zack T 171]

There's a big difference between dealing with someone who's presumably fully conscious in Lacey Evans, vs someone who's been knocked out/possibly concussed in Goldberg.

 

Look back at Miz vs John Cena from Wrestlemania 27 when Miz got concussed midway through it, or Brock vs Taker at Wrestlemania 30 when Undertaker got concussed midway through it and you'll notice a pattern - If someone suffers a concussion mid match, it goes off the rails. Can't really be helped, given that the other person is AT BEST on autopilot, and at worst barely functional.

 

And I don't really expect Charlotte to make up for Lacey Evan's botching. What I'd expect is her to be able to help guide Lacey to a somewhat decent match, but sometimes the chemistry just isn't there for any number of reasons even if the talent is. I mean just because AJ Styles is really good doesn't mean he's gonna get good matches out of Baron Corbin.

[Kam 243]

That was an interesting Raw!

 

Opening with a nice little brawl. I thought they went a little OTT with the pyro during the stunt. With Graves shouting 'holy shit' (without even trying to censor it) you knew the night was going to be different to the usual Raw. I didn't like the sombre announcers afterwards - I think they should save that stuff for when there are actual accidents. I can still remember when Owen died and when King had his heart attack, always reminds me of stuff like that.

 

So Viking Raiders are heels then? The Samoa Joe attack would have been better if he had been built up better, but for now, it didn't really mean anything (he's had SO many losses on PPV). I don't see Joe as a threat to Kingston, when I really should.

 

I'm liking the Maverick/Truth angle - some nice funny moments. Although I'm getting a little sick of seeing the same group of superstars constantly made to look like chumps chasing Truth.

 

I REALLY don't understand the need to bring the Street Profits up? They can't book the tag teams they've already got, why add another one in!

 

The Maria/Mike Kanellis stuff was a surprise! I knew they had resigned but I didn't know she was actually pregnant again. I wonder when WWE found out - after they signed their renewal? When they first debuted together, she announced she was pregnant soon after, which I thought might piss off some at WWE. For it to happen a 2nd time, hmmmmmm. Calling Mike her bitch was a WTF moment. Then for her to lay into him like that during the match, I wonder if we'll actually see a big angle with them now. Although it still feels weird since they've been hardly used - besides their recent 205 LIve run.

 

They've hinted at the AJ/Club heel turn for some time now, so that wasn't a surprise. Hopefully it's not too late for Anderson/Gallows, fans need to see them as a genuine threat.

 

Overall - the first Raw in some time where I'm actually interested to see what happens next week, that has to be a good thing :)

Edited July 2, 2019 by Kam

[Zack T 171]

That elimination stipulation on Seth/Becky vs Andrade/Zelina made no sense. The only reason I can think for the elimination stipulation was to allow a commercial break between "eliminations" to keep in line with this new mandate about commercial breaks during matches.

 

But it made absolutely no sense. What if Seth eliminated Andrade, but Zelina eliminated Becky, then what? Seth vs Zelina? We know that ain't happening, it's gonna be a clean sweep one way or the other. I doubt that was Heyman booking.

 

I watched all of Raw but only half paid attention to it as I was playing games on my other monitor. I thought it was kind of surprising to have Rey come back, only to lose to Bobby Lashley. Especially since I'd be willing to bet Braun's gonna beat him at Extreme Rules. But whatever, Rey's kind of left out. He did have a US title feud to return to with Joe, except Joe lost the US title to Ricochet and moved on to the WWE title, so him and Rey's feud seems to be over with no real conclusion...and that's weird, given how personal it got.

 

I thought maybe they'd do Ricochet vs Rey Mysterio, which would be a pretty cool thing to do. But instead we're doing Ricochet vs AJ, which is also really cool to do but what is Rey gonna do now?

 

Baron/Lacey are awful together.

 

I appreciate the continuity of progressing this Mike/Maria pregnancy story, but I'm also not enjoying it at all. It feels super awkward and stupid to me, and I wish they'd use that continuity on something else.

 

I love Nikki Cross when she's being a crazy chick who doesn't talk on the mic, just runs around like a lunatic. This friendship angle with Alexa makes no sense for her character, and I'm not enjoying Nikki on the mic. I think it's more to do with her lines than with her accent, and with the fact that I hate the story. But still, talking so much doesn't really suit her character.

 

Was glad to see Cedric and Cesaro get highlighted, though.

 

Drake Maverick and R-Truth were basically the highlights of Raw.

[Kam 243]

The Bray moment was cool, the mask looks terrifying but I don't have much faith in them running with it. I would have preferred for him to go after someone other than Balor though. I can see him beating Balor at SummerSlam...but like Samoa Joe, never winning the big one.

[Zack T 171]

Yea, Balor has reportedly asked for time off, so I imagine he'll lose to Bray at Summerslam and then disappear for a couple months.

 

Bray was off TV for almost an entire year. I feel like they only took him off TV for a minute to figure out where to go after him and Matt Hardy's team came to an end since it seemed Matt might've been retiring at that point in time, but then it just kept on going...

 

Raw basically said "What wild card rule? What draft split?" this week, for no reason. If your plan was to give Seth his rematch against Brock, you didn't need to bring over a bunch of Smackdown superstars to put in the match. Would've been just fine to have had a Raw superstars battle royal instead.

 

The brand split is so meaningless right now. I legit don't even know what show several superstars are actually on because they've never stopped going back and forth and I can't remember anymore. Alexa Bliss and Nikki Cross especially, who knows?

Edited July 18, 2019 by Zack T

[Kam 243]

The show has improved...but it still has a long way to go. I still don't care enough about the superstars and they still seem to be doing a rubbish job of building heels up (Brock and Charlotte seem to be the exceptions).

 

I thought the Brock beatdown of Seth was good, looked pretty brutal.

 

I hate 'The OC' name. I thought the AJ celebration was really cringey too.

 

Thought the 24/7 title stuff was good, although that scene with Maria and Braun with him just growling was another cringey moment. I wonder who's going to take the title off her, I can't imagine she'll hold it for long...