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Martial Arts

***Official RAW Thread - 18th April 2005***


Chris2K

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Preview:

 

http://www.smartgroups.com/picvault/29059114.jpg/raw.jpg

 

J.R. PLAYS THE GAME

April 18, 2005

 

Say it ain’t so.

 

Before RAW went off the air last week, Triple H declared a payback match for RAW from Madison Square Garden. But it wasn’t Triple H vs. Batista; it was Triple H vs. Jim Ross! WATCH: 56k | 300k

 

It looks like RAW’s announcer has been forced into an impossible position taking on The Cerebral Assassin and possibly suffering a Pedigree. Be sure to catch RAW to watch J.R.’s fate unfold Monday night.

 

WWE.com has learned that Muhammad Hassan has requested a one-on-one match with Shawn Michaels. According to Hassan, Daivari defeated HBK with relative ease last week on RAW. Will Hassan be able to duplicate the same success? And will Michaels hear from Hulk Hogan in regards to HBK's Backlash invitation? Be sure to watch RAW for the latest on these developments.

 

One week ago the Quad Cities crowd witnessed the unthinkable: a kiss between Lita and Kane. The allegiance of estranged husband and wife appears to mean serious trouble for Women’s Champion Trish, who was tormented by Kane all RAW long. She’ll have to be on her toes when RAW is presented from Madison Square Garden.

 

The fans will be looking to hear from Chris Jericho or Intercontinental Champion Shelton Benjamin, who clashed on Y2J’s Highlight Reel. What’s next for these to competitors, and what will Jericho have to do to get out of his self-proclaimed “funk” that’s gone on ever since he lost to Shelton at Taboo Tuesday?

 

Watch RAW this Monday (9/8 CT) only on Spike TV.

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Guest Jamie Mcmullen
Thats not fair J.R verses Triple H I think Triple H is to much of a coward to take his agresion out on someone his own size.
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Guest Dave7g
It may not be too bad tonight. Hogan is there, all the Smack-downers are there too. And traditionally when they do a show at MSG it's always a bit special. Don't worry Jamie I'm sure JR will be just fine.
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Guest the destroyer88
^^^^first off its not confirmed that hogan will be there and it was reported that the lottery draft wont happen tonight. but it will be a great show...hopefully....and hopefully JR wont be too rough on HHHs neck after Rosey screwed up his move lol
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Guest MARTIN316V1

The start with Edge and Benoit kinda reminded me from Raws back in 99, those opening segments always used to start up and then end with wrestlers brawling in the back. Last Man Standing match should be good, at Backlash i presume.

 

I wasnt really paying attention to what Trish was saying as i was too busy listening to the crowd. Lita is the most over heel in the company! World title shot! I thought it was funny when the crowd chanted 'slut' and Trish took exception and tryed to be funny saying dont call Lita a slut but the funny thing is the crowd were actually talking to Lita!

 

What the hell has Viscera got to do with Kane? It seems we will be treated to the honor of a Kane vs Viscera match at Backlash. The best part during the segment though were the crowd, The ''Lets go Mabel'' chants were hilarious!

 

I knew that Hogan's music would hit but i still marked out. Shame he cant do the leg drop. I know alot of people bash him but just look at how over he is, thats why he hasent retired! As long as he can still go he can work a crowd to perfection.

 

There seemed to be quite alot of peeps in MSG, he got a pretty good pop. Surprised to see Vince. When he was talking about how he hasent appeared on TV since the Rumble, i thought Christian would have said something about his f*** up. Great to hear that the Draft has been Announced, cant wait!

 

It seems Jericho/Shelton angle has only come about as they dont have a clue what to do with either off them. Having said that they've done a good job with the fued. Anyone notice Jericho had the song written on his hand?

 

Not sure what all that Chris Masters stuff was about. Why couldnt he have tryed it on an established superstar, rather then 'some guy in the crowd?'.

 

At least now they've finally decided to get some proper tag teams. The Heart Throbs. There gimmick seems very similiar to Billy and Chuck. Not sure what to make of them yet but at least there a real team. Regal's facial expressions were priceless!

 

J.R vs HHH went on far too long but JR did manage a nice blade job. Now come on people have been complaining for years that HHH buried Booker at Mania for waiting something like 10 seconds to pin Booker but what about the amount of timeit took for JR to pin HHH?! And when does one chair shot ever keep a man down? The old hardcore matches use to have about 20 chair shots per match but it was still never over! So i guess JR buried HHH, right? Im not saying he has but it just seems like double standards.

 

I thought it was a good show. Cant wait to see the Raw Superstars Live this week :xyx

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Guest AfinShou

I am saying it right here and now that I am a big fan of the Heart Throbs. They're like The Rockers mixed with Billy and Chuck. It's hilarious.

 

I still like Masters. And this gimmick is right off of Bob Backlund circa 94-95 I think, where he challenged anyone to break out of the Crossface CHickenwing. I dig it.

 

For the record, Coach was hilarious most of the night.

 

Benoit and Edge are both on fire right now. Nothing bad to say.

 

THe whole Lita/Trish thing is just funny. Good ol Vis spent 10 years with this company for that one moment. Trish's acting was great, and the whole backstage scene was comedy.

 

Shelton and Jericho...I'll just see where it goes. Dean looked alright out there.

 

Man oh man, I was so pleasantly surprised by the crowd's reaction to Christian. He was getting genuine pops. Yet another testament to the fact that if a gimmick is goofy enough, and they stick with it, the crowd will start to like it. It worked for Matt hardy. It worked for Cena. And now it's working for Christian. I'm pleased to say the least. And just as I saw a positive turn around for him, Vince comes out. I honestly figured Vince was going to end any chance of him ever getting big right there. But it went surprisingly well. Even thought he'll get squashed next week, it was good to see him get that much.

 

Haha, I'm always happy to see JR get his ass kicked. 10/10 main event for me.

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Guest The Beltster

Opening was great and at least it had a point, to set up Benoit vs Edge at Backlash. A nothing match really, but it will be good, wrestling-wise.

 

Trish is EASILY the worst actor in wrestling. You can tell she is forcing every word, a perfectly crap heel. Lita got a priceless reaction from the NY crowd, which was to be expected as they are harsh. Why the hell do they keep bringing back Mabel?! He is a talentless hick, nobody gives a toss. Rhyno gets fired, as does Matt, yet Mabel gets a mini-push? WTF?

 

Now, I can agree about Hogan not being out there everyweek as his body cant handle it.....but with saying that fans would get sick of hogan as a top guy I have gotta disagree.

 

Hulkamania is the most special thing in all of wrestling...past, present, or future, and whether someone is a Hulkamaniac or not, they cannot deny this fact. Unlike other aspects of wrestling, Hulkamania is something that you HAVE to experience live. You can see it on TV 1000 times, but until you see it live, you cant feel it and this is what happens to people when Hogan walks out....they feel it.

 

It doesnt get repetitive, because this is their chance to feel it and experience it...so while other things might run their course, Hulkamania does not, because while we are all seeing it on TV, the people in the building are feeling it most likely for the first time in 15 years, so there is an intangible to seeing it live.

 

This is why Hogans pops do not diminish, at least not much, and this is why SmackDown! went through 2 segments each time Hogan came out, because the people there were all about it.

 

Go watch Judgment Day 2003 where Mr. America takes on Piper and listen to his ovation at the end of the match when he's posing....its louder than any face on the card got at that time...and this is over a year since his return.

 

The point is, when does the "nostalgia kick" end?? Its been over 3 years since his return, wouldnt you think that a nostalgia kick would of ended by then?? Thats because this is the real thing, not some nostalgia crap that so many people like to pan it off as. The fact is, Hulk Hogan is over, not because of nostalgia, but because he is Hulk Hogan! The nostalgia excuse is BS. Just because Hulkamania was gone from the WWF/WWE for 10 years, then it came back does NOT mean that its not real this time...it does NOT mean that people are just getting kicks in for old times. Hell, NYC, MSG did you hear them tonite?? they boo'ed everone and everything except Batista....everyone other face got boo'ed....and what was the 'smart' NYC crowd chanting all night?? "HOGAN"

 

My point is that everyone is thinking that this Hogan thing is just a kick for old times, a nostalgia thing, and its not real....thats false IMO. Where has any building given an incling that this is a short term deal??

 

Sure, it may get old to people watching tv, who have to sit through 15 minutes of Hogan chants....but those same people would be on their feet chanting the day Hogan comes to their town. I guess what im saying is that if the whole Hogan thing is a nostalgia kick for two weeks then everyone gets sick of him, then you're right. BUT, I'm saying that its not nostalgia. A nostalgia pop example would be a Steve Austin, like back in 2003, he gets popped the first couple of weeks, then it dies down. Well Hogans live pops havent gone down since he's been back, and i dont predict them to do so.

 

Heres Shawn Michaels, the lovable babyface, who is getting hung on the top rope, and what is the crowd doing?? They are cheering because they know Hogans about to do a run-in...does this make any sense? No it doesnt because Hulkamania is an intangible and it will ALWAYS be over and the most special thing in wrestling.

 

My point is, a main event Hogan wouldnt get old except to a select few who can never be happy about anything....a main event Hogan would work because this whole Hulk thing isnt a nostalgia kick...its the real thing, and its back, JACK!

 

Christian is the man, I have been a peep since the start, I always preferred him over Edge when they were tagging and it looks like he is FINALLY going to get somewhere, the fans are getting behind him and he is awesome on the mic and in the ring. Vince seemed to be walking fine too huh?

 

Shelton has no heat, at all. Its a shame as he is a talented kid, but he has no charisma and thus nobody cares. Jericho is stale.

 

Chris Masters sucks anus. WWE are trying to cover up the fact he is a shitty wrestler by making him do this crap every week, how about just sending him back to OVW instead?!

 

The Heart Throbs were great, I was laughing my ass off. Its about him we got more teams with matching outfits, a team name and who look and act alike, like teams of old. Finally it has happened and we got two in one week! GREAT going Vince, finally.

 

HHH vs JR was pure crap. HHH isnt over in the slightest yet he is still being pushed as the main guy on RAW, getting much more airtime than Batista and working the main event. Batista is being set up like Benoit was, to fail. He is being booked like crap, its so stupid.

 

Oh, and Batista's pop was nice, but it wasnt even close to Hogans :worship :D

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I'm sorry belty I know you love Hogan, but there ain't no way a main event him now would work. You remember 2002 right? When he was champ, he still got the big pops, but people did get tired of his novelty routine, when its a main event match, simply because it's not 1989 anymore. Its great to see the crowd cheer and all that, but they can't waste 2 segments every show on that, cause its pointless. Remember he could all those pops, but the buyrates and ratings were still lousy. Thus again, why give him a main event push? Say all you like about Cena and Batista, but they are getting just as much buyrates as Hogan would now, and are a billion times healthier.

 

Sure Hogan's pop is bigger than everyone else, but so what?

 

Antonio Inoki's pop is prolly bigger than anyone else's in Japan, but you don't wanna see him main eventing shows consistently, because its modern times now. You have to look to the future. It's obvious the Hogan thing is a nostalgia kick. Everyone loves Hogan cause he reminds them of their childhood and the good old times of the 80's. Should he be headlining? Hell no, because he's past it, and has nothing to offer.

 

Don't understand how you could think otherwise, when its so obvious. I mean if you think Vince is gonna push him again just cause the people in arenas pop for him, then he's insane. The last time he did that the ratings practically went down. Sure everyone loves to see him live, cause heck its Hulk Hogan, how many times now are you gonna see that. But for a fan watching TV, to see that every week, same thing? Boring, and they'll turn off and not care.

 

You forget, Hulk Hogan is nostalgia. He's not living on it. He is it.

 

It does great things cause people remember the good old days, but it doesn't sell PPV's. People in Liverpool love Ian Rush, but would they give a toss if he's playing for them every week? Hell no. But everytime he was at Anfield, you could bet he'd get a bigger ovation than anyone else. See what I'm getting at?

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Guest The Beltster
I'm sorry belty I know you love Hogan' date=' but there ain't no way a main event him now would work. You remember 2002 right? When he was champ, he still got the big pops, but people did get tired of his novelty routine, when its a main event match, simply because it's not 1989 anymore. Its great to see the crowd cheer and all that, but they can't waste 2 segments every show on that, cause its pointless. Remember he could all those pops, but the buyrates and ratings were still lousy. Thus again, why give him a main event push? Say all you like about Cena and Batista, but they are getting just as much buyrates as Hogan would now, and are a billion times healthier.[/quote']

 

Why? Why wouldnt it work? Is he more popular than anybody else? Yes. Do the fans crave Hulkamania and want to see it? Obviously yes. And people got tired of his routine in 2002? Show me the proof, there is none. Ratings didnt die like people make out as I'll explain in a second. PPV buyrates were no worse than ever, and he actually helped pull GREAT buyrates for No Way Out, WMX8 and Backlash.

 

And like you said, sure, they are getting the same buyrates Hogan would....the same, not better. So where is the harm? The buyrates wouldnt dip, and people want to see it, its so blatantly obvious that people adore the man, give us what the majority of us want, Vince! Hulkamania!

 

Sure Hogan's pop is bigger than everyone else' date=' but so what?[/quote']

 

So what if he is the most popular man in wrestling? Well I'd say thats pretty important. Plus, it shows, no, it PROVES Hulk Hogan is more popular and over than ANYBODY else, thats including Cena and Batista. And what do you do with you're most popular guy? You make them the main event, you put the gold around their waist and you run with it. If it fails, it fails, but at least you tried. Think about it, they ran with JBL for 10 months, and business didnt die, WWE is still alive and SmackDown! is still on the air. Its weak and it sucks, granted, but with Hulk Hogan as WWE champion, business on SD! would pick up 100%, no doubt about it.

 

Antonio Inoki's pop is prolly bigger than anyone else's in Japan' date=' but you don't wanna see him main eventing shows consistently, because its modern times now. You have to look to the future.[/quote']

 

Why not make Inoki the main event? If he can still go like he could in his prime (and lets be real, Hogan is no worse now than he was in 1990, as he was never a great wrestler anyways!) and the fans want him there, why not? I think alot of people these days seem to forget its all about giving the fans what they want, not about pushing some cruiserweight because he can do a back flip and he is 20 yrs old. The fans OBVIOUSLY want Hogan, its so blatant and anybody who says otherwise is digging for things to pick apart. The fans want Hogan, I say give us Hogan. Whats the worse that can happen? Ratings wouldnt budge? Big deal, you dont know until you try, and although they tried in 2002, that wasnt the REAL Hulkamania that we are getting now. It was a wierd hybrid of Hulk Hogan and Hollywood Hogan. Now we have the Real American music, the oldschool posing and dancing, the oldschool way he walks to the ring, everything is coming together like it SHOULD have been in 2002/2003. Plus, they tried with the young guys and time and time again it has failed.

 

It's obvious the Hogan thing is a nostalgia kick. Everyone loves Hogan cause he reminds them of their childhood and the good old times of the 80's. Should he be headlining? Hell no' date=' because he's past it, and has nothing to offer.[/quote']

 

I TOTALLY disagree. If its nostalgia, why does my 3 year old son go ballistic when Hulk Hogan is on TV? Why is Hulk Hogan his favourite wrestler? Why does he not care about ANY other wrestler? Sure, I like him, but my son doesnt like him just because I do. I like alot of things that my son could care less about. Lets face facts, Hulk Hogan appeals to all ages, even people who werent even born when Hulkamania was running wild the first time. The nostalgia excuse is just that, an excuse to try and explain and figure out how Hulk Hogan is so popular and how he appeals to so many different generations. I dont buy the nostalgia deal for one second, at all. Its garbage.

 

Nothing to offer? Myself and everybody at WM and RAW beg to differ, it seems.

 

Don't understand how you could think otherwise' date=' when its so obvious. I mean if you think Vince is gonna push him again just cause the people in arenas pop for him, then he's insane. The last time he did that the ratings practically went down.[/quote']

 

No, ratings DIDNT go down, not like so many people seem to think. I explained all this before by posting the ratings. Hulk had a bad week, ratings wise, for RAW and SmackDown!, both on the same week, the following week ratings rebounded and then when Taker won the belt, ratings went down, then when the Rock won the belt, ratings went down again, and then when Brock got the belt, ratings when down AGAIN. So saying Hulk Hogan offers nothing means putting the belt on Taker, Rock or Brock would be crazy too, cos they hurt ratings more than Hulk Hogan, the proof is black and white in the old ratings that are listed all over the net.

 

Sure everyone loves to see him live' date=' cause heck its Hulk Hogan, how many times now are you gonna see that. But for a fan watching TV, to see that every week, same thing? Boring, and they'll turn off and not care.[/quote']

 

If thats the case, then the same can be said for Cena, Batista, Austin, Rock, Taker, HHH, Orton, Guererro, Mysterio and EVERYBODY. I dont understand the logic of people saying "Seeing Hogan every week would make him boring and he would die out!" yet they never say it about anybody else. What is the difference between seeing ANYBODY else on TV every week and seeing Hulk every week? Is there something about everybody else which makes them not become stale on TV everyweek that doesnt apply to Hogan? Come on, thats freakin crazy talk!

 

The way I see it, Hulk Hogan and now reached that level of Icon status that nobody else will ever reach and the fans are gonna let him know it and go crazy for him every time he comes out, whether its once a week or once a year. His pops will never diminish IMO, not now.

 

You forget' date=' Hulk Hogan is nostalgia. He's not living on it. He is it.[/quote']

 

He has nostalgic qualities to alot of us, and alot of casual marks, but like I explained earlier, explain his nostalic qualities he has to all the kids who go mental for him? They never were around when he was in his prime and so they dont hold nostalgic love for him.

 

Nostalgia = crap excuse, IMO.

 

It does great things cause people remember the good old days' date=' but it doesn't sell PPV's. People in Liverpool love Ian Rush, but would they give a toss if he's playing for them every week? Hell no. But everytime he was at Anfield, you could bet he'd get a bigger ovation than anyone else. See what I'm getting at?[/quote']

 

Ian Rush playing football which is a legit sport and Hulk Hogan wrestling in a scripted work are two entirely different things and cant be compared at all. The fact is, Rush couldnt help Liverpool win football games anymore, but if Vince McMahon said so, Hulk could beat 20 men in a handicap match with his arms tied behind his back. Thats the difference. So although I see what you're getting at, it makes no sense.

 

I say we wait it out and lets see how it goes. I am just happy to see the real Hulk Hogan back on TV. If it ends at Backlash, so be it, thats fair enough and at least I got another healthy dose of Hulkamania, if it continues, even better. Whatever happens, its great to see Vince is doing whats good for business and what the fans have been asking for.

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Guest Simon

I disagree about people saying that the Benjamin/Jericho thing hasn't been built up/isn't interesting. If you ask me the feud is interesting and both guys are pulling it off well... and I'd also question the comment that Benjamin has no charisma, he's cool as ****!

 

GO AWAY Chris Masters. Just go away.

 

And is it just me or is this the FIRST time these heart throb guys have appeared? No vignettes? No previous appearances? If so.. sucky sucky, and I'll probably take a LONG time to warm to these guys. At least they're attempting a tag division I suppose.

 

I have to say, as much as I hate HHH, what the hell was the point in the 30 minute wait for Batista to make JR cover HHH? The fans didnt care enough to drag such crap out. I agree that Batista is being booked to fail here... really they are completely destroying any momentum he had at this rate. This is the WORLD CHAMPION for gods sake and he's doing a chair shot run in during a HHH v JR match. Jeez.

 

As for the Hogan thing however, I'm somewhere in the middle between Jung and Beltmark on this. Of course you have to mark out like hell when Hogan comes down, and it'll be cool, but I still completely disagree with the need to put the title on him or anything. He doesn't need it, like I've said before, and can be in high profile feuds without taking the place of the new stars. If you ask me I'd like to see them try and drag this out for a major Hassan v Hogan at Summerslam, I don't really want this to be a short term deal, but I'd just like to see it carried out much, much better than it was in 2002.

 

Cause incase you don't remember... 2002 sucked balls.

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See belty, you're seeing it like I don't like Hogan. But I do. You just love him so much, you're ignoring reality. This is 2005. All you're telling me is everyone loves him. Yeah cause of what he's done for wrestling.

 

Hogan gets crowds to love him, but he doesn't change buyrates, and he's not the man to change anything now, so whats the point? They've got to look to the future. We can't keep having every 2 years "oh go on lets give Hogan another push cause he's popular" cause you arent going anywhere, and the company won't be furthered.

 

He'll be popular than anyone when he's 90, should we stick in the main event then?

He's the most popular wrestler of all time, of course everyone loves him.

 

I'm sorry belty, but your Hogan bias is way too far over. Business to improve has to go to re-create itself. You have to move on. Thus what's the point of sticking Hogan on top again? Sure he's real popular, but he will always be. You're saying why doesn't HHH move on, well why doesn't Hogan? He'll be popular forever, because of what he has done, but thats the past. And you can't build the future of a company on a broken down guy, who's best years were 20 years ago.

 

He'll forever be huge, but so what? Does that mean he has to get a main event push everytime?

 

Your son likes him, because of all the stories you've told him, and tapes you've shown him, thus that is nostalgia isnt it? They have to move on, and build business around new people. Cause when Hogan dies or don't come back, and you've always stuck him in main event, what else do you have? Nothing and WWE dies a quick death.

 

There is no disputing his popularity or what he's done, but he's not gonna change the ratings or buyrates, just like in 2002, and and he's not gonna cause the company to do any different, thus whats the point? Say Cena and Batista are no better sure, but they are the future that WWE has to build upon whether we like it or not. And you can't build it on a guy who's simply nostalgia. Its great to see him, but thats it. He's a legend, but he's not the future, and he's not a main eventer now.

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Guest The Beltster
See belty' date=' you're seeing it like I don't like Hogan. But I do. You just love him so much, you're ignoring reality. This is 2005. All you're telling me is everyone loves him. Yeah cause of what he's done for wrestling.[/quote']

 

No, I'm not saying it as if you dislike him, I'm saying alot of fans in general, (Internet smarks, mainly) like to pick anything Hogan does to pieces. Everybody loves him for what he has done in his career, sure, but the same holds true for HBK, Angle, Benoit, Taker etc, so are they nostalgia acts?

 

Hogan gets crowds to love him' date=' but he doesn't change buyrates, and he's not the man to change anything now, so whats the point? They've got to look to the future. We can't keep having every 2 years "oh go on lets give Hogan another push cause he's popular" cause you arent going anywhere, and the company won't be furthered.[/quote']

 

How do you know he wont change them until its tried? Like I said, last time Hogan was around, as much as he was over, it was not the real Hulk Hogan or the real Hulkamania, like we are seeing now.

 

Look to the future? Sure, I agree, and how do you do that with green rookies like Chris Masters and losers like Heidenreich? They NEED to have a mixture of the old and the new. Looking to the future doesnt mean ignoring the past, and when the past is the most popular man you have, you use him and thrown him into the mix with the future guys. It will only help them.

 

He'll be popular than anyone when he's 90, should we stick in the main event then?

He's the most popular wrestler of all time, of course everyone loves him.

 

Like I said, Hogan can still go right now. He may have injuries and be slow, but his matches wont be any different than they were in 1990. When he is 90, that wont be the case so of course he cant be used then, but in the last few years he may have left where he CAN still be useful, why not use him?

 

I'm sorry belty' date=' but your Hogan bias is way too far over. Business to improve has to go to re-create itself. You have to move on. Thus what's the point of sticking Hogan on top again? Sure he's real popular, but he will always be. You're saying why doesn't HHH move on, well why doesn't Hogan? He'll be popular forever, because of what he has done, but thats the past. And you can't build the future of a company on a broken down guy, who's best years were 20 years ago.[/quote']

 

Like I said, yes, you have to look to the future, but you cant ignore the past. The future doesnt know how to work, that much is blatantly obvious. They need the older guys to get in there, teach them, show them how things work. The point of sticking Hogan on top is because its what the fans want. Why go against the grain? People want to see Hogan, and they dont want to see him getting jobbed out like he was in 2002 which cause interest to wane slightly (although not much at all, to be honest).

 

The difference between HHH and Hogan is that Hogan is over, the fans want to see him and he is a legend...HHH isnt over, the fans dont want to see him and he is certainly no legend (I'm not talking for all fans, of course HHH has his fans, but there arent many).

 

He'll forever be huge' date=' but so what? Does that mean he has to get a main event push everytime?[/quote']

 

Yes! Of course it does. Why put you're most popular guy in, say, opening card matches, or comedy matches, or even worse, job him out and force the fans to become indifferent, thus losing you're company thousands of dollars in the process? WWE needs to listen to what the fans want, for once. They have been going totally against the grain for several years by shoving HHH and JBL down our throats, now the fans have spoken and they want Hulk Hogan, and if Vince has any sense, he will give us Hulk Hogan in a more prominant position than job boy or opening card nobody.

 

Your son likes him' date=' because of all the stories you've told him, and tapes you've shown him, thus that is nostalgia isnt it? They have to move on, and build business around new people. Cause when Hogan dies or don't come back, and you've always stuck him in main event, what else do you have? Nothing and WWE dies a quick death.[/quote']

 

I havent told my son stories of Hogan, sure he has seen his matches on tapes, but he has also seen every single other wrestler from 1985 - 2005 on tape and DVD, and NONE of them grab his attention like Hulk Hogan. I will be 100% truthful and say it was shocking to see my 3 yr old son 'marking out' for Hulk Hogan the way I used to, without being pushed etc. He is a Hulkamaniac because there is something about Hogan which appeals to him. He is too young to give me a good reason why he likes him, but something about him appeals to my son, and so many other kids right now are getting to see Hulkamania and they love it.

 

Vince needs to be wise, and use him sensibly. Dont put the belt on him if you dont want to, fine, but dont dare job him out and ruin what we have going on in 2005. Stick the US title on him and make him the semi main event match of every PPV at worst, Hogan will raise buyrates if booked right, no doubt about it at all.

 

There is no disputing his popularity or what he's done' date=' but he's not gonna change the ratings or buyrates, just like in 2002, and and he's not gonna cause the company to do any different, thus whats the point? Say Cena and Batista are no better sure, but they are the future that WWE has to build upon whether we like it or not. And you can't build it on a guy who's simply nostalgia. Its great to see him, but thats it. He's a legend, but he's not the future, and he's not a main eventer now.[/quote']

 

Like I have said, 2002 Hollywood Hogan wasnt Hulkamania, wasnt the real Hulk Hogan, it wasnt what we are getting now. I bet you Hulk Hogan can help buyrates and ratings if used this way and booked like he has been, no doubt.

 

And again, the nostalgia thing doesnt cut it with me, its nonsensical to say Hogan is all nostalgia, cos the kids who have never seen him love him, plus have you ever heard of a nostalgia kick lasting 3 years? I havent.

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Of course it does belty! Look at Dad's Army, or Happy Days, they are so popular and will forever it be popular, because they remind you of the glory days.

 

And Hogan didn't help buyrates before, so why would he now? I'm not saying job him out, or misuse him, but this isn't 1989, you can't make him a main event in this day and age. He didn't raise buyrates in WCW when it was Hulkamania in 2000, and he didn't raise buyrates in 2002 when he did yellow and red trouser Hogan, so I don't see what now is gonna change?

 

He's a legend, but he's not the man to change everything, because WWE won't ever revert back to the 80's type, which Hogan was king of. He's not the answer.

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Guest The Beltster
Of course it does belty! Look at Dad's Army' date=' or Happy Days, they are so popular and will forever it be popular, because they remind you of the glory days.[/quote']

 

Do children who didnt grow up watching Dads Army or Happy Days like watching it now? No chance! If you put on Dad's Army to a group of 5 yr olds, they would probably cry themselves to sleep! :lol Same with Happy Days...those shows hold nostalgic value to people who had good memories growing up watching them.

 

Hulk Hogan appeals to 5 yr olds today who have never seen him before, thus there is the huge difference. He might hold nostalgic value for some, but for many othes he is just hugely popular because they dig him.

 

And Hogan didn't help buyrates before' date=' so why would he now? I'm not saying job him out, or misuse him, but this isn't 1989, you can't make him a main event in this day and age. He didn't raise buyrates in WCW when it was Hulkamania in 2000, and he didn't raise buyrates in 2002 when he did yellow and red trouser Hogan, so I don't see what now is gonna change?[/quote']

 

Like I said, it was different. First off, we can even consider bringing up WCW's pathetic version of Hulkamania. He never really fit in as a face in WCW, the WCW fans never accepted him from the start like the WWF and now WWE fans do. So his 2000 WCW Hulkamania deal was crap, a was his entire face run in WCW. Worthless.

 

In 2002 in the WWF, he was turned into a wierd Hollywood nWo face yellow & red Hogan. It wasnt Hulkamania, it was just a face nWo Hollywood Hogan who played air guitar, came out to Jimmi Hendrix and acting like Hollywood Hogan, it was never going to work to the point where it would help business, never.

 

Now its different. Cant you see and feel the difference? Its Hulkamania, man. Its back and its legit this time, its the REAL DEAL. Not some crappy half assed version like in 2002.

 

I'm telling you dude, this is different. Its special this time, and the fans are gravitating towards it, moreso than they did in 2002 and 2003. Christ, he is getting bigger pops than Cena and Batista combined.

 

Make him WWE champion after JBL regains the belt. It will work, no doubt. SmackDown! will be much more credible with Hulk Hogan on top than it is with JBL, Cena, Guererro, Big Show etc.

 

He's a legend' date=' but he's not the man to change everything, because WWE won't ever revert back to the 80's type, which Hogan was king of. He's not the answer.[/quote']

 

Maybe it should revert back into the way it was when people gave two shits about it, rather than the rushed stuff we get today.

 

I'm hoping this isnt just a build up to Hogans retirement. He still has alot to offer and the fans are craving Hulkamania, no doubt.

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Jesus, I think you've taken 1 too many Hogan acid trips. If you're telling me Hulkamania and idolising a 50 year old man is the future of WWE like you're making out, then WWE may as well shut up shop now, because that idea is ludicrous.

 

You're only seeing this from your point of view. For me, and I'm sure for loads of people, this Hogan comeback is just like his last one. Sure its great to see him back, but main eventing as the company figurehead, you've got to be joking. You're looking at it, from a complete Hogan marks view, and that everyone is thinking the same as you, which is untrue. If I saw Hogan live, I'd cheer just as loud, cause hell its Hulk Hogan, but I wouldn't want him to be headlining and the focus of the show cause he's a 50 year old broken down man, who can barely wrestle, and who's schtick is complete 80's.

 

You have to see it from everyone's perspective. I'm taking your Hogan point of view in. But well you're the only one on the site, who thinks Hogan should be champion, everyone else loves him, but thinks thats a ridiculous idea. Thus does that mean "everyone wants him as champion" as you're saying?

 

To you, an avid Hulk fanatic, it feels different. To most others, its just the same. The 1980's version is what the kids love. They love seeing him, cause when they see him, thats what they think of. You think they are gonna still love him, when they see this old broken down Hogan working week in, week out? I don't think so.

 

I know its hard for you to see from outside a Hogan mark objective, but try and see what everyone else thinks. Remember that thread you did about Hogan being champ, what were the results?

 

I love Hogan, but come on lets be realistic, he isn't the guy to carry the company now.

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Guest The Beltster
Jesus' date=' I think you've taken 1 too many Hogan acid trips. If you're telling me Hulkamania and idolising a 50 year old man is the future of WWE like you're making out, then WWE may as well shut up shop now, because that idea is ludicrous.[/quote']

 

I didnt say Hulk Hogan is the future, you're not listening to me, instead you're hearing what you want to hear and putting words in my mouth. I said WHAT HARM WILL IT DO to use Hogan as a main guy? Not the ONLY main guy, but a main event guy who can mix it up with guys like HHH, Cena, Taker, Orton etc and help teach them and show them how to work, and give them a little credability at the same time.

 

Put it this way, do you think JBL as WWE champion is better for business than Hulk Hogan as WWE champion? If you're answer is yes, then YOU are crazy.

 

You're only seeing this from your point of view. For me' date=' and I'm sure for loads of people, this Hogan comeback is just like his last one. Sure its great to see him back, but main eventing as the company figurehead, you've got to be joking. You're looking at it, from a complete Hogan marks view, and that everyone is thinking the same as you, which is untrue. If I saw Hogan live, I'd cheer just as loud, cause hell its Hulk Hogan, but I wouldn't want him to be headlining and the focus of the show cause he's a 50 year old broken down man, who can barely wrestle, and who's schtick is complete 80's.[/quote']

 

And you are only seeing this from you're point of view. I can only speak for myself, but when I see Hogan blowing the roof off every building he walks in, his merchandise selling like hotcakes and the cross-generation appeal, I think I am speaking for alot of other people too.

 

No, its not like the last comeback, at all. You may say you like Hogan, but its obviously just a casual "Yeah Hogan is pretty cool" kinda deal, especially if you cant see the huge difference in how he is being portrayed now compared to how he was in 2002.

 

You say you wouldnt want to see him headline, and thats fine, and I'm sure alot of people feel the same way, but why cant you open you're mind a little and just think for one second that maybe, just maybe, a shitload of people DO want to see him headline? Is it that hard to believe and accept? Not at all.

 

You have to see it from everyone's perspective. I'm taking your Hogan point of view in. But well you're the only one on the site' date=' who thinks Hogan should be champion, everyone else loves him, but thinks thats a ridiculous idea. Thus does that mean "everyone wants him as champion" as you're saying?[/quote']

 

Yes, I'm the only one on this specific site, which probably makes up about 00000000000000000000000000.1% of the UK WWE fanbase, let alone the Worldwide fanbase, who thinks Hogan should be champion. Whats you're point? Like I said before, internet smarks (which is what everybody here is) love to bash Hogan or pick him apart or down him or anything else to try and make out he isnt a credible main event guy, which IMO is stupid, he is a main event guy and always will be. Hulk Hogan in the midcard doesnt nor ever will work.

 

Plus, I'm not the only guy here who thinks he should be made champ. Go back and read my original thread, several people agreed. :xyx

 

To you' date=' an avid Hulk fanatic, it feels different. To most others, its just the same. The 1980's version is what the kids love. They love seeing him, cause when they see him, thats what they think of. You think they are gonna still love him, when they see this old broken down Hogan working week in, week out? I don't think so.[/quote']

 

How can you say that with a straight face? How do you know how it feels to everybody else? You, just like me, ONLY know how it feels to yourself. You say kids love the 80's version, yet the kids werent even freakin born in the 80's, so what appeal would that hold to them? ZERO! They dont love him cos of the past, they love the guy cos he is magic, he has an aura about him that people dig, its as simple as that.

 

Plus, who said he would be working week-in and week-out? Not me. Taker doesnt work week-in and week-out. He works PPV's only and the occasional SD! appearance, why cant Hogan do that? Do you put Takers appeal down to nostalgia too? How about HBK's? I dont, because its not. They are over cos they are over, no other reason. They are over cos they are entertaining, they bring excitement and they know how to work, not because of anything else.

 

I know its hard for you to see from outside a Hogan mark objective' date=' but try and see what everyone else thinks. Remember that thread you did about Hogan being champ, what were the results?[/quote']

 

You are speaking for everybody again, which is silly, because you can only speak for yourself. Sure, alot of people on TWO will agree, but what does that prove? That a miniscule minority of internet smarks who are known for ripping Hogan a new asshole whenever he does anything but who adore Chris Benoit like he is a God even though he has never drawn or done anything to help wrestling, isnt happy that Hogan is back, taking airtime from some precious cruiserweights? Big deal. And again, go back and read my thread again, several people agreed.

 

I love Hogan' date=' but come on lets be realistic, he isn't the guy to carry the company now.[/quote']

 

No, he isnt THE guy to carry the company, but wrestling doesnt work that way these days anyways, its a team effort, gone are the days of the champion carrying the company. Hulk Hogan as WWE champion would work IMO. Sure, it wont happen, which I'm sure makes the internet fanbase happy. Now we get to see JBL have another run instead, and Edge who cant draw hungry flies to warm ****.

 

Awesome! :lol

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I thought that was one of the worst RAWs I'd seen in a while, so much so that Smackdown has been better than it the last coupla weeks which I haven't been able to say for months and months. Did enjoy the 'you screwed Matt', 'we want Matt' & slut chants though, try editing all of them out for the re-runs WWE :P

- Hogan's return was fun, though by about the 10th time he and HBK had done Hogan's poses for the crowd, I was all for Hassan & Davari coming back and beating them down just to end it.

- Masters thing was a waste of time, give him a match against someone established for a change.

- Wasn't really into the tag match even though I love Regal. Good to see another new tag team though.

- Does Batista even bother to show up for the first hour of RAW? He's the world champ and yet never appears til well into the 2nd half...bizarre. If the HHH V JR match was 5 mins, it went on for about 4 minutes 50 seconds too long.

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Jeez you know what forget it belty. Whatever I say you'll disagree with. You just can't see it because of how much you love Hogan. You're just presuming everything because you adore him. Practically everyone in the Hogan champion thread said we like him, but we don't want him as champ. So what if everyone in wrestling is like that? I mean out of everyone who answered, it was quite a diverse bunch, some who know loads about wrestling, some who know little, so whats that tell you?

 

But no to you, its just a little forum. Few agreed on having Hogan back, nearly everyone said not as champ. This sums it up really.

 

"You say you wouldnt want to see him headline, and thats fine, and I'm sure alot of people feel the same way, but why cant you open you're mind a little and just think for one second that maybe, just maybe, a shitload of people DO want to see him headline? Is it that hard to believe and accept? Not at all.

 

What evidence do you have to suggest they would? Apart from you, I don't know anyone. Go have a vote on this site. You say this site is a minority sure, but it encompasses a huge range of fans, of different types of wrestling, different ages, and people who know loads and know less. And in your thread, go back and read it, and see the people who'd rather not have him as champ hugely outnumbers those who say he would. Its a demographic vote, of all ages, all interests. So maybe shouldn't you open your mind a little, and realise your in your own fantasy land, and just cause people like Hogan, doesn't mean he should be headlining. Go have a look at the thread again, and you tell me again who's not accepting the truth.

 

But this is pointless, because you won't listen to anything, because you can't see outside the Hogan box, and don't realise reality, so please go watch Hulk Still Rules again. You're about the only person on this entire site who thinks Hogan should be main eventing, and this is a site of wrestling fans as I've said meeting every demographic. That and the general public think he's a laughing stock. So please just listen to reality. I like Hogan, and so do millions. But it stops there. Not everyone loves him like you do remember.

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