Orlando Magic in the NBA Finals

[Guest The Beltster]

Eat sh*t LeBron James, and thank God the Magic killed all the nonsense Kobe/LeBron hype, it was unbearable.

[Guest Y2James]

Gutted. Lebron is still the man though.

[Guest The Beltster]

Gutted. Lebron is still the man though.

 

If LeBron was the man, the Cavs would be in the NBA Finals, they arent. Dwight Howard is the man and the Orlando Magic are a better team than the overrated Cavs.

 

I'm so sick of hearing about LeBron James like he is the 2nd coming of Michael Jordan. James is a great player, but he isnt a patch on Jordan and never will be.

 

Lakers in 5 or 6, but I'm proud of the Magic, going all the way to the finals when nobody outside of us Magic fans believed they could and doing it all without their starting PG and knocking out the defending champion Celtics in their building.

[Fidel Cashflow 130]

If LeBron was the man, the Cavs would be in the NBA Finals, they arent. Dwight Howard is the man and the Orlando Magic are a better team than the overrated Cavs.

 

I'm so sick of hearing about LeBron James like he is the 2nd coming of Michael Jordan. James is a great player, but he isnt a patch on Jordan and never will be.

 

Lakers in 5 or 6, but I'm proud of the Magic, going all the way to the finals when nobody outside of us Magic fans believed they could and doing it all without their starting PG and knocking out the defending champion Celtics in their building.

 

You know that's not true, Belty. The things he's done in the playoffs for the past 3 years have been nothing short of incredible. All LeBron James is proving is that one man, no matter his greatness, cannot win a title by himself. There is no one on the Cavs aside from LeBron better than Hedo, or Lewis, or Alston (team would be even better if Nelson was healthy), or anyone as good coming off the bench as Pietrus. The Magic won because they are clearly the better team. LeBron James didn't lose this series.

 

The things he's done have been incredible, and I'd find it impossible to place MJ on a higher level at this point in their careers. MJ had Boston and Detroit to contend with, but LeBron DID drag his squad of no-names to the finals at age 22. You cannot discount the guy. Doing what he's doing at 24.

 

As for the Magic, I think it's odd to see them discounted so much against the Lakers. Sure the Lakers are much deeper team than Cleveland, and Kobe is Kobe, but Hedo and Lewis are being continually underrated, despite their performances. The Lakers are built to beat them, though. They're not as deep with shooters, but between Odom, Gasol, and Bynum they have good defensive and offensive presence in the paint. I think the Lakers win, but every game will be close, and wouldn't be shocked at all of Orlando won.

[Guest The Beltster]

You know that's not true, Belty. The things he's done in the playoffs for the past 3 years have been nothing short of incredible. All LeBron James is proving is that one man, no matter his greatness, cannot win a title by himself. There is no one on the Cavs aside from LeBron better than Hedo, or Lewis, or Alston (team would be even better if Nelson was healthy), or anyone as good coming off the bench as Pietrus. The Magic won because they are clearly the better team. LeBron James didn't lose this series.

 

The things he's done have been incredible, and I'd find it impossible to place MJ on a higher level at this point in their careers. MJ had Boston and Detroit to contend with, but LeBron DID drag his squad of no-names to the finals at age 22. You cannot discount the guy. Doing what he's doing at 24.

 

As for the Magic, I think it's odd to see them discounted so much against the Lakers. Sure the Lakers are much deeper team than Cleveland, and Kobe is Kobe, but Hedo and Lewis are being continually underrated, despite their performances. The Lakers are built to beat them, though. They're not as deep with shooters, but between Odom, Gasol, and Bynum they have good defensive and offensive presence in the paint. I think the Lakers win, but every game will be close, and wouldn't be shocked at all of Orlando won.

 

No I disagree, it is true. He isnt as good as MJ was regardless of what he did over the past 3 years. He may have done some incredible things, but they havent won anything and it all comes down to winning. LeBron didnt lose the series, but he didnt win it either. I've seen Jordan beat good teams in series' on his own when Pippen was M.I.A, when Horace and Rodman were M.I.A and he has carried the Bulls on his back. LeBron doesnt do that, he doesnt make his team mates better IMO, he is a great individual, but he doesnt have a trickle down effect like Jordan did.

 

You say his team are made up of no-names, but I find that hard to swallow. Delonte West is a good player and Mo Williams is an All-Star. If they were such a bunch of no-names, they wouldnt have won 66 games and had the best record in the NBA. I saw them play alot this year and it was far from being the LeBron James show, they had a pretty balanced attack, they just had matchup nightmares with Orlando. If they had played Boston they would be in the NBA Finals right now.

 

James is a great player, probably the best individual player in the NBA right now or tied with Kobe, but he is no MJ, in my opinion, and thats not rose tinted glasses because I was never much of an MJ fan to begin with.

 

Lakers in 5 or 6, hopefully they can get a return trip next year with Nelson playing and use this as a learning experience.

 

GO MAGIC!!!

[Guest Fiona]

I have to agree with Fidel. Lebron James is a fantastic player; the problem is he doesn’t have the backup players he needs to make the team great.

 

I think back to the Edmonton Oilers of the 1980’s, when they were mowing through the NHL unstoppable. The cornerstone of the team was Wayne Gretzky, arguably one of the greatest hockey players ever to lace up a pair of skates. As good as Gretzky was, what made him great were the players along side of him. The team made up of Paul Coffey, Mark Messier, Jari Kurri, Grant Fuhr and Andy Moog, all great players in their own right, gave the Oilers 5 Stanley Cups in a row. It wasn’t until Edmonton traded Gretzky to LA and Messier to New York that the bloom came off the rose.

 

The same can be said with the Chicago Bulls. When Jordon was having his record breaking seasons he had great back up too. When your as good as Jordon it’s not hard to be great with players like Scotty Pippen, Bill Cartwright, Will Perdue and the rest.

 

I guess what I’m trying to say is, it doesn’t matter how good a player is, they aren’t the whole team. The great teams of the past have always had at least 3-4 players that are able to help support and carry the rest. If the Cavaliers can pick up more support in the draft or through trades, I think you’ll see a huge difference next year.

[Guest The Beltster]

I have to agree with Fidel. Lebron James is a fantastic player; the problem is he doesn’t have the backup players he needs to make the team great.

 

I think back to the Edmonton Oilers of the 1980’s, when they were mowing through the NHL unstoppable. The cornerstone of the team was Wayne Gretzky, arguably one of the greatest hockey players ever to lace up a pair of skates. As good as Gretzky was, what made him great were the players along side of him. The team made up of Paul Coffey, Mark Messier, Jari Kurri, Grant Fuhr and Andy Moog, all great players in their own right, gave the Oilers 5 Stanley Cups in a row. It wasn’t until Edmonton traded Gretzky to LA and Messier to New York that the bloom came off the rose.

 

The same can be said with the Chicago Bulls. When Jordon was having his record breaking seasons he had great back up too. When your as good as Jordon it’s not hard to be great with players like Scotty Pippen, Bill Cartwright, Will Perdue and the rest.

 

I guess what I’m trying to say is, it doesn’t matter how good a player is, they aren’t the whole team. The great teams of the past have always had at least 3-4 players that are able to help support and carry the rest. If the Cavaliers can pick up more support in the draft or through trades, I think you’ll see a huge difference next year.

 

Nobody said James wasnt a fantastic player, he just isnt Jordan. He has backup, the Cavs have a fine team, its not like its LeBron and then a bunch of nobodies, he has All-Star Mo Williams, Delonte West, Daniel Gibson, Big Z, Verajao and although he is older, Ben Wallace can still go on occasion.

 

If Jordan had those guys, he would, IMO, go further than LeBron did because Jordan made the people around him better whereas I dont believe James does.

[Guest Drake]

Ok, I'm the first on the hate bandwagon towards Lebron, I hate him and I love Kobe. I wanted the Magics to win cause I love the city of Orlando and Howard/Torkoglu but to say that LeBron doesn't make the Cavs a better team is ridiculous Belty.

 

LJ IS the freaking Cavs. The Cavs are a bunch of no names GOOD players, that's it. Theres a lot of difference between the regular season and the playoffs. West, Z, Williams, Varejao and Gibbs all did good during the regular season because they had GREAT chemistry thanks to Lebron, that's it. Apart from Lebron, there's not a single guy on that team that can help him consistantly, not one!

 

Lebron was the sole reason why the Cavs got better, he made ALL his teammates better, but when it was time for them to step up in a difficult series against Orlando, they didn't, simple as.

 

Now, let's not forget that I hate Lebron and think Kobe is miles better than him. But to say that Lebron didn't made his team better is wrong.

[Fidel Cashflow 130]

Nobody said James wasnt a fantastic player, he just isnt Jordan. He has backup, the Cavs have a fine team, its not like its LeBron and then a bunch of nobodies, he has All-Star Mo Williams, Delonte West, Daniel Gibson, Big Z, Verajao and although he is older, Ben Wallace can still go on occasion.

 

If Jordan had those guys, he would, IMO, go further than LeBron did because Jordan made the people around him better whereas I dont believe James does.

LeBron took that squad (where is #2 is a combo guard that if his shot isn't falling he's useless) to only ONE home loss all season and the best record in the NBA. If that isn't making your team better, then no one, ever, has made their team better.

 

MJ never did more with a lesser team. Every title he won he had one of the 50 Greatest NBA Players of all time in Pippen right there on the wing. And he had a ferocious conglomerate of role players. BJ Armstrong, Horace Grant, Luc Longely, Tony Kukoc, Steve Kerr, Dennis Rodman, and Ron Harper ALL did their given jobs better than LeBrons teammates do.

 

They have no defensive presence in the post and Z kills them with his jumpshot infatuation. Unlike Jordan, LeBron doesn't have another player on his team that can guard elite wing players. He doesn't have a pure point guard, and he doesn't have anyone on that team that can take over in critical moments if the night isn't his night.

 

Michael is my favorite athlete of all time, and I have an unwarranted hatred for everything related to the state of Ohio ,but he was JUST as unsuccessful before he got a better team around him. No one can do it alone.

[Guest The Beltster]

I dont disagree that LeBron helped haul a good team to a great record, but if you watched that team throughout the season you will see that those guys played out of their minds, creating their own shots and on top, you had LeBron playing his one-man army style of ball which won so many games for them it wasnt even funny. James won tons of them on his own, it wasnt like he was making all those other guys so much better, he just did alot of it against lesser teams throughout the season on his own.

 

Jordan made his team mates better, Howard makes his team mates better. Who ever thought Turk and Nelson were anything other than no-name pretty good players until they played with a developing Howard? Who would Courtney Lee be right now if he wasnt playing with Dwight? I think there are guys who make their team mates (not teams) better and those who just haul sub par teams to good records on their own, LeBron does it on his own he is that good, he doesnt make those around him better. Just my opinion.

 

At the end of the day, I'll never say LeBron isnt talented, he is the 2nd best player in the NBA right now but he will NEVER be the player Jordan was, IMO. There was only one.

 

Oh, and bye bye puppets too, thank f*ck.

[Guest Fiona]

Yea but Fidel, your never going to have the dynasty teams that you had in the 80's. What with the expansion drafts and NBA player salaries going through the roof, teams just can't afford to have a team with the talent that the Bulls had with Jordan and Pippen.

 

Shame really.

[Guest Drake]

I dont disagree that LeBron helped haul a good team to a great record, but if you watched that team throughout the season you will see that those guys played out of their minds, creating their own shots and on top, you had LeBron playing his one-man army style of ball which won so many games for them it wasnt even funny. James won tons of them on his own, it wasnt like he was making all those other guys so much better, he just did alot of it against lesser teams throughout the season on his own.

 

Jordan made his team mates better, Howard makes his team mates better. Who ever thought Turk and Nelson were anything other than no-name pretty good players until they played with a developing Howard? Who would Courtney Lee be right now if he wasnt playing with Dwight? I think there are guys who make their team mates (not teams) better and those who just haul sub par teams to good records on their own, LeBron does it on his own he is that good, he doesnt make those around him better. Just my opinion.

 

At the end of the day, I'll never say LeBron isnt talented, he is the 2nd best player in the NBA right now but he will NEVER be the player Jordan was, IMO. There was only one.

 

Oh, and bye bye puppets too, thank f*ck.

 

To be fair, Jameer was freaking great during his College days, leading his St. Jo team to NCAA Elite 8, so it's not like he's a no name at all. Yeah, obviously Dwight makes that team and all the players better, like all the great players do.

 

I still disagree with you about guys like Delonte, Z and Mo Williams creating things for themselves etc... With James they wouldn't be anything. He IS the ONLY reason why they have raised their game during this season and when is was time for them to step up (in the Orlando series) they didn't, because they just weren't good enough.

 

Still, like you said, IMO, Lebron is the second best player behind Kobe. Until Lebron's jumper evolves into a consistant one then I can't see him passing Kobe as the best right now.

 

At this age, Lebron has done a lot more than what Kobe and MJ did. Lebron doesn't have a good team that can back him up and until he does, he won't win shit. You can be as good as he is but without a team you ain't going nowhere.

 

That's why I honestly think that if the Cavs don't bring two star players to Cleveland this summer then Lebron is 100% leaving during the summer of 2010.

 

Still, I hate Lebron, but you gotta give the **** praise.

 

And about the puppets, I loved them, especially the one where the Lebron puppet was throwing chalk all over the place everytime he clapped his hands. :lol

 

It would be funny if Adidas did a puppet commercial of Howard to mock the Nike ones.

[Fidel Cashflow 130]

Yea but Fidel, your never going to have the dynasty teams that you had in the 80's. What with the expansion drafts and NBA player salaries going through the roof, teams just can't afford to have a team with the talent that the Bulls had with Jordan and Pippen.

 

Shame really.

 

I don't see how you can say that when the Boston Celtics exist. Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and Kevin Garnett on the same team? Tim Duncan, Tony Parker, and Manu Ginobli? Tracy McGrady, Yao Ming, and Ron Artest? Carmelo Anthony, Chauncy Billups, and Kenyon Martin? Kobe Bryant and Pau Gasol?

 

It's no less possible.

 

To be fair, Jameer was freaking great during his College days, leading his St. Jo team to NCAA Elite 8, so it's not like he's a no name at all. Yeah, obviously Dwight makes that team and all the players better, like all the great players do.

 

I still disagree with you about guys like Delonte, Z and Mo Williams creating things for themselves etc... With James they wouldn't be anything. He IS the ONLY reason why they have raised their game during this season and when is was time for them to step up (in the Orlando series) they didn't, because they just weren't good enough.

 

Still, like you said, IMO, Lebron is the second best player behind Kobe. Until Lebron's jumper evolves into a consistant one then I can't see him passing Kobe as the best right now.

 

At this age, Lebron has done a lot more than what Kobe and MJ did. Lebron doesn't have a good team that can back him up and until he does, he won't win shit. You can be as good as he is but without a team you ain't going nowhere.

 

That's why I honestly think that if the Cavs don't bring two star players to Cleveland this summer then Lebron is 100% leaving during the summer of 2010.

 

Still, I hate Lebron, but you gotta give the **** praise.

 

 

Yeah, I agree with everything.

 

I don't think Cleveland can get him that extra player, and I fully expect (hope) him to be in a Knicks jersey in 2010. LeBron, David Lee, Wilson Chandler, and Nate Robinson coming off of the bench (if we can keep him) = finals appearance at the least. If things REALLY go our way, LeBron and Bosh both, but that's a sure-fire-championship-wet-pipe-dream

[Guest The Beltster]

Bosh will end up in Orlando before he ends up in NY. And even with LeBron, the Knicks will suck.

[Fidel Cashflow 130]

Bosh will end up in Orlando before he ends up in NY. And even with LeBron, the Knicks will suck.

 

pfft

 

The days of the 90's Knick dynasty will soon return. Every franchise goes through their slumps.

 

and I really don't think Orlando has any sort of cap space for Bosh who will probably not settle for anything less than a maximum deal, and with Nelson/Lewis/Hedo/Howard, the Magic have a lot of money tied up. Namely that 126mil Lewis is getting. The shoe company bonuses will be enough to get LeBron or Bosh into NY.

 

How do you feel about Nelson trying to make a return for the finals?

[Guest The Beltster]

pfft

 

The days of the 90's Knick dynasty will soon return. Every franchise goes through their slumps.

 

and I really don't think Orlando has any sort of cap space for Bosh who will probably not settle for anything less than a maximum deal, and with Nelson/Lewis/Hedo/Howard, the Magic have a lot of money tied up. Namely that 126mil Lewis is getting. The shoe company bonuses will be enough to get LeBron or Bosh into NY.

 

How do you feel about Nelson trying to make a return for the finals?

 

90's Knicks dynasty? All they did in the 90's was get eaten alive by the Bulls! :lol

 

I doubt Bosh will end up in Orlando but he is friends with Howard and if Turk doesnt re-sign next season we will have money for Bosh, about 80 million free overall so it can happen.

 

I dunno about Nelson in the finals. I doubt he will play and if he does it might screw up our chemistry and rotation, plus he will be rusty as hell. If he can go, I'd take 15 minutes off the bench from him max.

 

Edited June 2, 2009 by The Beltster

[Guest Drake]

:lol @ the video Belty posted.

[Fidel Cashflow 130]

Lakers win aaannnnnnnnddddd Hedo declares for free agency the same night. Double Loss