Kinect gaming thread

[Paul 584]

It's a Wii Game it has no appeal :lol

 

I would be joking but I really don't like these game. I'd really like to go out and bowl with other people as opposed to relying on a piece of technology.

 

And? YOU dont OTHERS do. This isnt about opinion its about facts and your argument is based on what you like rather than what actually is.

 

 

No it isn't. Stop using reductio ad asurdum.

 

 

If you must try to be a smart arse at least try to spell the Latin right.

 

 

I understand this, and I love video games that abandon conventions, like Shadow of the Colossus. I just don't like where this motion sensitive thing is going. Yes it's an alternative now but look at the PS3, it's incorporated the sixaxis which is more or less a weak, restricted motion control and the bloody thing is nauseating.

 

And its used in a huge minority of games. In fact I cant remember the last game I played that used it.

 

 

Motion control is appealing to casual gamers who couldn't have given a damn about gaming until it got all family friendly and started to ignore the fan bases.

 

Oh no! More people getting into gaming! The world will end!

Seriously, this is a stupid point from you Dante, of course they want more people to get into gaming. And how it 'ignored the fan base' is beyond me.

 

That and it is unimmersive.

 

Wont that depend oon the game?

 

Defend this all you like but by getting up and moving around apstically you will be dran to the fact that you are playing a game as opposed to sitting there playing on a controller and having your brain shut down and focusing only on the game. Game technology needs to be moving towards making simpler movements so you remove or simplify the process between thought and on screen action and raise immersion.

 

And doing the motion and having it copied on screen will be less natural than doing something totally different? Talk about a total lack of understanding of how the mind works.

 

 

And I will stand by this. Games need to be about the games. Any medium should be about the story it's telling rather than the medium. Would To Kill a Mockingbird become better or different if it was etched in stone?

 

And some people will say its better in film form than as a book.

 

 

You're wrong. Simply wrong, no 'opinion' no arguments, you are wrong.

[etz 78]

If the Wii proved anything, it's that a gimmicky controller only gets you so far. That's why there are millions of Wii's all around the world sitting on shelves gathering dust.

 

That said, at least Kinect doesn't have nunchuck. I find that aspect of Wii and Move very annoying. It's an interesting tech, but how applicable it will eventually be to the Xbox's core franchises (considering they're mostly shooters) remains to be seen. Also, it's damn expensive and needs mucho room to jump about in.

[Paul 584]

Yeah I wont argue with that Etz, the Wii didnt live up to its potential. There were a few decent games out (Zelda: Twilight Princess springs straight to mind) but they concentrated too much on family and party games, good for their fan base but bad in terms of bringing in 'gamers'.

[etz 78]

Yeah, I really like the concept of an alternative, motion based controller, but so far they've all been flawed in their implementation, in one way or another.

 

Hopefully, they can rejig Kinect to work in smaller spaces. A cheap gun controller for shooters to supplement Kinect also wouldn't go awry.

[Paul 584]

For sure, at least as an optional control system for people who dont want to pretend to hold a gun up (I'd prefer the tactile feel myself, but I assume people wont want to buy extra periphials).

 

As I say, the Kinect isnt an innovation, the Playstation Eye did the same years ago just nowhere near as well. Its the difference between a PS1 and a PS3 I guess. But it should hopefully lead to innovations in gameplay. Touch wood.

[Maxximus 353]

Stop using reductio ad asurdum

 

Expelliarmus!

[Guest Saz]

I prefer Cockus Engorgio! Suck on that Hermione! :)

 

Anyhoo, I think personally that a controllerless interface is probably going to be the next step for perhaps maybe science and other non gaming aspects.

 

If you remember Minority report and Iron Man, those are the Cool interfaces, so I suspect that Kinect is a way for Microsoft to look into developing the technology whilst making money back through games.

 

This is the first step.

Edited November 11, 2010 by Saz

[Guest The Beltster]

No I say it because I can;t wrap my head around creating a game when it's perfectly simple to go out and do the actual activity without any sort of penalty. And you're creating the insinuation in your own head, so I can say "I didn't say that" because frankly I didn't, you are trying to make it seem like I did.

No, the insinuation was there, try and say it wasn't all you like, but its blatant.

 

No it isn't. Stop using reductio ad asurdum.

Do you have a habit of trying to act clever online and use words you never actually use in reality? Do you also have a habit of spelling them wrong when you are trying to be clever? Reductio ad absurdum, try again, or just dont try at all, because it makes you look like so smarmy using Latin just for the sake of it.

 

Well done, mission achieved on both fronts!

 

And yes, it is the same. Games are games, its not supposed to replace the actual activities, its just a game. Your stupid bowling comment was nonsense. Why bother playing FIFA when you can have a kick around with your mates or join a Sunday league team? Why play driving sims when you can just jump in your own car and drive around? Why by COD when you can join the army? It can be said about almost anything, and its retarded in every instance.

 

My Playstation one controller had an analog stick, iIve never seen one without it. alright, that's still over a decade of the same controller and vastly different game experiences

 

http://www.gamescastlive.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/psx.jpg

 

The original PS1 pad had no sticks.

Edited November 11, 2010 by The Beltster

[Guest Saz]

I'd actually like to make the point that the Gaming industry is criticised heavily for adding to the obesity rate by encouraging people to stay at home with a control method that takes no physical effort.

 

The Nintendo Wii, despite all its faults has not had such criticism and has been praised for its exercise properties, now tell me, how many games companies want to ignore the potential to add credence and respectiablity to their acclaims by not producing a game that involves movement?

 

Wii fit, Dance party and to a lesser extent any karaoke style game encourage you to use your skills given to you by nature.

 

I wonder how many people would constantly run everywhere if they were immersed in GTA using a motion controller?

[Guest The Beltster]

And before that, the TV industry was criticized for the same thing, having people sitting there getting fat hence the term couch potato, they are both also criticized for making people violent due to the shooting games, yet never criticized for encouraging joy riding due to the racers...its all ridiculous. Lazy people are lazy people, if they didn't have a TV or console, they still wouldn't get up and jog around the block.

[Maxximus 353]

I wonder how many people would constantly run everywhere if they were immersed in GTA using a motion controller?

 

Only if I got to beat up hookers.

[Guest Dave7g]

[YOUTUBE]IY1r9DXZCZU[/YOUTUBE]

 

Would you honestly rather be sitting on a couch with a controller than doing that?

[Maxximus 353]

Depends on if I had a television that size, but I get your point.

[Guest Dave7g]

I'd definetly take a couple of eh, asprin before playing that.

[Guest Saz]

I don't mind the Kinect as long as I never EVER have to see that demonstration with Skittles the Tiger and that asian kid ever again!

[Maxximus 353]

Okay, that made me genuine "lol" hard, Saz!

[Guest Dante Spears]

And? YOU dont OTHERS do. This isnt about opinion its about facts and your argument is based on what you like rather than what actually is.

 

I never claimed this to be a fact about these games in general, just a reason why I didn't like them.

And its used in a huge minority of games. In fact I cant remember the last game I played that used it.

The point is they incorporated it into their basic controller so they had every intention to incorporate motion control into gaming. This is what I don't want, I don't want motion control to take over. It's like stereoscopic 3D, yes it's a gimmick but this summer there were a plethora of movies released in 3D that had no right to be. It got to the point where i couldn't go out and see certain movies like Toy Story 3 because everywhere was showing it in 3D and I didn't want to because my eyes don't agree with 3D. I don't ant it to reach a point where the gimmick merges with the mainstream stuff and motion control becomes the norm.

 

Wont that depend oon the game?

And doing the motion and having it copied on screen will be less natural than doing something totally different? Talk about a total lack of understanding of how the mind works.

Have you ever heard of the theory of total cinema? the theory that everything in Cinema is leading to projecting perfect realism on screen, and that is the desire to drive people. Well it extends to gaming, the ultimate goal of gaming is to provide total immersion, becoming part of the experience.

 

I'll just quote someone else who had already said pretty much the same feelings I have. And before anyone gets on my case, I developed this stance about motion control years ago when i first learned the Total Cinema and played the Wii. He can just word it better.

 

See, the hypothetical ultimate model of gaming is total immersion. The whole Matrix thing. Plugging your brain into a virtual world that you see with your own eyes, feel beneath your own feet, and commit genocide upon its inhabitants with a napalm launcher in your own hands. Technology is still a long, long way from this, though. I'm talking about a direct neural interface here, something that plugs into your spinal cord and diverts the signals from your brain to the computer avatar, so your own body doesn't move, but the one in the game does. You think "do a hip thrust," your own body stays still and Captain Jockbugger on the Planet Killtron debases himself for the enemy.

 

What this is is the shortest possible connection between intention and in-game action. "Shoot that guy," think you, and lo is that guy shot. Thought → action. That's what technology should be working towards. Standard controllers have a far shorter brain-action delay than motion controls. The movement of our actual, physical bodies is minimized to the tiny finger-jerks it takes to press a button. Thought → tiny movement → action. You can't yet put your mind wholly into the game, but you can channel it through your thumbs while the rest of your body lies as dead and motionless as it would in our hypothetical future Matrix containment tubes. It takes a little while to get used to it, and figure out what buttons apply to what actions, but hey, it took a while for you to learn how to read, too.

 

Motion controls, meanwhile, are thought → large movement → however long it takes for the console to register that movement → action. It's not immersive, it's going in completely the opposite direction to being immersive.

 

And yes, it is the same. Games are games, its not supposed to replace the actual activities, its just a game. Your stupid bowling comment was nonsense. Why bother playing FIFA when you can have a kick around with your mates or join a Sunday league team? Why play driving sims when you can just jump in your own car and drive around? Why by COD when you can join the army? It can be said about almost anything, and its retarded in every instance.

Because it can be argued games are about realizing a dream, something that is outside of your forseable future or else would prove dangerous to you. FIFA is fine because it lets you realize the dream of playing soccer in the world cup or whatever it is. If a game came out as playing soccer in a field at the community park it'd be horrible because you'd be focusing on realizing a dream that's completely accessible without any real threat to yourself. Racing Games and War games allow you to realize dreams of doing dangerous stuff without threat to yourself

 

It's games like Wii Sports Resort I don't understand. Why the hell should a Frisbee Sim exist when you could go out and play the thing effortlessly with no problems to yourself. Why should they have a shitty bike sim discouraging people from going out and riding an actual bike?

 

If you must try to be a smart arse at least try to spell the Latin right.

 

Do you have a habit of trying to act clever online and use words you never actually use in reality? Do you also have a habit of spelling them wrong when you are trying to be clever? Reductio ad absurdum, try again, or just dont try at all, because it makes you look like so smarmy using Latin just for the sake of it.

 

Well done, mission achieved on both fronts!

 

One letter. I forget one letter in respelling a phrase in a different language. A dead language at that. One freaking letter. Are you honestly all so petty that you're going to attack me for not adding a freaking B in my haste?

 

And yes I do use Latin in day to day talking, much in the same way I point out logical fallacies with my friends (who in turn do so to me).

Edited November 11, 2010 by Paul

[Paul 584]

I never claimed this to be a fact about these games in general, just a reason why I didn't like them.

 

You stated, quite clearly, that gameing should be only about games, not the entire experience.

 

 

The point is they incorporated it into their basic controller so they had every intention to incorporate motion control into gaming.

 

Or they had every intention of it being an optional control method for games developers to take advantage of.

 

This is what I don't want, I don't want motion control to take over. It's like stereoscopic 3D, yes it's a gimmick but this summer there were a plethora of movies released in 3D that had no right to be. It got to the point where i couldn't go out and see certain movies like Toy Story 3 because everywhere was showing it in 3D and I didn't want to because my eyes don't agree with 3D. I don't ant it to reach a point where the gimmick merges with the mainstream stuff and motion control becomes the norm.

 

Except its not going to happen is it. They'll always be people who prefer to only use fingers and thumbs. If the Wii didnt create a full on surge into motion control only then the friggin Kinect and Move wont.

 

 

 

It's games like Wii Sports Resort I don't understand. Why the hell should a Frisbee Sim exist when you could go out and play the thing effortlessly with no problems to yourself. Why should they have a shitty bike sim discouraging people from going out and riding an actual bike?

 

Yeah, why play inside with the family when you could go outside and throw a frisbee in the rain? Or ride in heavy traffic in the middle of the heavily built up area you live in.

 

 

 

One letter. I forget one letter in respelling a phrase in a different language. A dead language at that. One freaking letter. Are you honestly all so petty that you're going to attack me for not adding a freaking B in my haste?

 

And yes I do use Latin in day to day talking, much in the same way I point out logical fallacies with my friends (who in turn do so to me).

 

If you try to look smart then expect to be pulled up when you **** it up.

 

edit: Oh and the stuff about the gaming experience shite. Total bollocks. Gaming should be aiming towards being fun, not being as quickly responsive as possible. Thats only a target for certain gamers.

[Guest Dave7g]

You can look at PC gaming too, I played Farenheit on PS2 before with a controller, now I'm playing it on PC with a mouse and keyboard and far better graphics, and guess what? I personally find it to be a far more enjoyable experience. I could actually see Heavy Rain being better on move now that I think about it, but Kinect would immerse you into the game more.

 

Open your mind.

[Guest Fiona]

I never claimed this to be a fact about these games in general, just a reason why I didn't like them.

 

The point is they incorporated it into their basic controller so they had every intention to incorporate motion control into gaming. This is what I don't want, I don't want motion control to take over. It's like stereoscopic 3D, yes it's a gimmick but this summer there were a plethora of movies released in 3D that had no right to be. It got to the point where i couldn't go out and see certain movies like Toy Story 3 because everywhere was showing it in 3D and I didn't want to because my eyes don't agree with 3D. I don't ant it to reach a point where the gimmick merges with the mainstream stuff and motion control becomes the norm.

 

The only thing I understood in the above quote was the first sentence.

 

Have you ever heard of the theory of total cinema? the theory that everything in Cinema is leading to projecting perfect realism on screen, and that is the desire to drive people. Well it extends to gaming, the ultimate goal of gaming is to provide total immersion, becoming part of the experience.

 

Seriously who the hell has time to get totally immersed in a game? Someone who sits there all day playing a video game is a total f*cking loser. What about work, girlfriends/boyfriends just life in general. Chances are if your wasting your time getting totally immersed in a video game, you don't have any of the above.

 

Because it can be argued games are about realizing a dream, something that is outside of your forseable future or else would prove dangerous to you. FIFA is fine because it lets you realize the dream of playing soccer in the world cup or whatever it is. If a game came out as playing soccer in a field at the community park it'd be horrible because you'd be focusing on realizing a dream that's completely accessible without any real threat to yourself. Racing Games and War games allow you to realize dreams of doing dangerous stuff without threat to yourself

 

It's games like Wii Sports Resort I don't understand. Why the hell should a Frisbee Sim exist when you could go out and play the thing effortlessly with no problems to yourself. Why should they have a shitty bike sim discouraging people from going out and riding an actual bike?

 

You've just taken all the fun out of me playing Team Fortress, you do realize that don't you?

 

One letter. I forget one letter in respelling a phrase in a different language. A dead language at that. One freaking letter. Are you honestly all so petty that you're going to attack me for not adding a freaking B in my haste?

 

And yes I do use Latin in day to day talking, much in the same way I point out logical fallacies with my friends (who in turn do so to me).

 

Bullshit, no one uses Latin anymore, except for Darkstar when he's discussing world issues, oh and the Pope. I know your not Darkstar, so you must be the Pope?

Edited November 11, 2010 by Fiona