UFC 100 Thread

[DC 536]

They're already on top form.

I had to laugh at this one...

Frank Mir is pretty good... maybe not "that" good. But he is a true Martial Artist. I think once the benifits from Brock's STEROID era get "flushed" from his system he won't be able to bully or manhandle other guys like that. Just look at Brock, he is shrinking and not just because his workout program changed. Brock is just a big ball of juiced up muscle. He's not testing positive, because he's not currently "on cycle".... just watch. As he shrinks back to normal human being size- he'll start to get his ass kicked!

:lol

 

Why can't they just accept that Brock knows what he's doing and is a legit fighter? It surely can't simply be down to the fact he was a pro-wrestler. MMA fans aren't that petty... are they?

 

EDIT - This one is either the greatest subtle dig at someone in history or the guy who wrote it is a complete moron.

Frank Mir has more heart than almost no one else in MMA.

Edited July 12, 2009 by DC

[Guest The GS]

Who said those quotes DC?

[Guest Diablo]

Sherdoggers.

[Guest The GS]

Sherdoggers.

 

The forum there is it?

[Dead Crow 370]

EDIT Edited September 30, 2018 by DraVen

[Guest Jack]

Now that Liddell and Couture are shot, Tito is gone and a few other of the past names are non-factors, it's worrying that a lot of the supposed attractions in a lot of divisions, are fighters the fans won't buy into, mainly because they're not American. There is a lot of pressure being put onto Lesnar to be 'the man' for the UFC and I'm not sure if he can do it. the problem is, for a lot of fans, including the hardcore ones, he's still the "ex-WWF guy" and that's not good. Until he's established as a legitimate fighter, can he really be the man to take UFC to the next level? Personally, I don't think so. There are still a lot of doubters out there and in a time when the UFC momentum is stalling a fair bit, there needs to be a real, main event attraction. Lesnar can be that person, but until people stop calling him unproven, then he's not going to be.

 

His MMA record ths far, is a joke and it reflects badly on MMA as a whole that this guy should be in the position he is in, after facnig such poor opposition. I don't think Mir is close to the fighter he once was, despite the win over Nog, who is also done. Couture? Meh, the guy has a glass jaw and is blown up and past it.

 

Regardless of whether you outright agree or not, there are still a lot of question marks over Lesnar. The fact is, he's been thoroughly rushed and I do think it'll backfire. He needed to face some legitimate heavyweights before being crowned "Heavyweight Champion" during a time when the UFC needs a strong, reliable draw.

[Guest Nemesis Enforcer]

Love the Brock promo after his win, was just golden and the fact all the MMA fans on Sherdog are going to mental over it make sit even more sweet. They seem to forget that Brock was one of the best collage wrestlers long before he ever went into pro wrestling.

 

They seem to not realise that if Brock is just 'a fake wrestler' then it makes their MMA hero's look piss poor that they are getting beaten by 'a fake wrestler'. Brock has won 4 out of 5 fights now, if they like it or not he is an MMA fighter and a winning one at that.

[Guest Jack]

Love the Brock promo after his win, was just golden and the fact all the MMA fans on Sherdog are going to mental over it make sit even more sweet. They seem to forget that Brock was one of the best collage wrestlers long before he ever went into pro wrestling.

 

They seem to not realise that if Brock is just 'a fake wrestler' then it makes their MMA hero's look piss poor that they are getting beaten by 'a fake wrestler'. Brock has won 4 out of 5 fights now, if they like it or not he is an MMA fighter and a winning one at that.

MMA fans aren't hating him because he's a good "heel". They don't like him because he's a 5 fight veteran, who hadn't trained as a legit fighter for years before taking up MMA, and him being champion, makes the sport look bad. He needed to prove himself first or at least fight genuine class opposition, and he's doen neither.

 

Fact is, he isn't even that good, anyway. He's immensely strong, but from a technical perspective, is he really that impressive? I don't think so, at all. So far, what's he shown as a fighter? Good takedowns and decent G+P. Aside from that? Not much, really. He looks more one-dimensional than a few of the previous UFC heavyweight champions.

 

I don't think he'll draw, personally. And that's a shame because Dana is banking on him being the next Tito or Chuck, otherwise his rise wouldn't have been planned so meticulously and rushed.

 

I actually think a good step would be to put him against someone else who isn't proven, to show whether he really is a step above. Kimbo, for example, would have been a good first choice for his UFC debut and a fight with Lashley would make more people think whether he is class, than a victory over a shot Mir or Couture.

[Guest ScottyB]

Lesnar Vs Lashley = Buys.

[Paul 584]

MMA fans aren't hating him because he's a good "heel". They don't like him because he's a 5 fight veteran, who hadn't trained as a legit fighter for years before taking up MMA, and him being champion, makes the sport look bad. He needed to prove himself first or at least fight genuine class opposition, and he's doen neither.

 

He kept in shape, trained still (theres a lot of crossover training in amatuer and pro wrestling) and has amazing physical skills. Add to the 5 fight thing that Couture wasnt exactly 10-0 before winning a UFC championship and you have a bit of an empty argument.

 

 

Fact is, he isn't even that good, anyway. He's immensely strong, but from a technical perspective, is he really that impressive? I don't think so, at all. So far, what's he shown as a fighter? Good takedowns and decent G+P. Aside from that? Not much, really. He looks more one-dimensional than a few of the previous UFC heavyweight champions.

 

Hes also got a lot more depth than many. He has a decent stand up and good takedown skills.

 

I don't think he'll draw, personally. And that's a shame because Dana is banking on him being the next Tito or Chuck, otherwise his rise wouldn't have been planned so meticulously and rushed.

 

Seems he already has.

 

 

Top 10 North American PPV buy rates, 2008

 

1. Boxing: Oscar De La Hoya vs. Manny Pacquiao, Dec. 6, 1,250,000

2. UFC: Brock Lesnar vs. Randy Couture, Nov. 15, 1,010,000

3. Wrestling: WrestleMania, Floyd Mayweather Jr. vs. Paul “Big Show” Wight, March 30, 670,000

4. UFC: Georges St. Pierre vs. Jon Fitch/Lesnar vs. Heath Herring, Aug. 9, 625,000

5. UFC: Lesnar vs. Frank Mir, Feb. 2, 600,000

6. UFC: Quinton Jackson vs. Forrest Griffin, July 5, 540,000

7. UFC: St. Pierre vs. Matt Serra, April 19, 530,000

8. Boxing: Felix Trinidad vs. Roy Jones Jr., Jan. 19, 500,000

9. UFC: Chuck Liddell vs. Rashad Evans, Sept. 6, 480,000

10. UFC: B.J. Penn vs. Sean Sherk/Tito Ortiz vs. Lyoto Machida, May 24, 475,000

 

 

 

 

One of the things that amuses me with Brock is the way people after every fight swore the next guy was the one who would be able to beat him, yet bar him making one huge **** up in his first Mir fight it just hasnt happened yet. Sure he doesnt have graple skills like Hughes, but why would he need to? He plays to his strengths and covers his weaknesses, like every god fighter should.

[Guest Cathal]

Yeah, I was gonna say, Lesnar has already proven he can draw and he will still continue to. All the MMA fans that hate him will no doubt pay to see to him lose.

[Guest The GS]

Of course Lesnar will draw....

He's brought over some WWE fans to UFC and he's a brilliant character and fighter....

He's basically a beast and blood hungry fans want to see how badly he can damage his opponents.

[Guest Jack]

He kept in shape, trained still (theres a lot of crossover training in amatuer and pro wrestling) and has amazing physical skills. Add to the 5 fight thing that Couture wasnt exactly 10-0 before winning a UFC championship and you have a bit of an empty argument.

Doesn't really matter, I don't think. The major difference is, people didn't really doubt Couture's legitimacy in the same way they doubt Lesnar. Aside from that, who did Couture dethrone? To go even further with this, it was years down the line before Couture became a draw.

 

As for him being a draw, I think there's definetly been some intrigue caused by him, but it wouldn't suprise me if the interest went down a lot. Think of Lesnar as being a new gimmick match, if you will. Say the...bamboo cage thing, whatever that was called. It was always going to create interest as it was new and mysterious. In the same way, people didn't know what to expect with Lesnar and that had a big effect on the success he's had so far. You have a point, the ratings have been strong thus far, but I can see the interest in him dwindling.

[Paul 584]

Doubting his legitimacy is for people who see themselves as hardcore fans in the know, but in fact cant be bothered to find out anything. Lesnar was, as you will know as a wrestling fan, a stupidly good wrestler. NCAA champ or some such, so his credentials arent exactly 'guy off the street' lke a lot of people make out.

 

I cant see his drawing power going down by much, the guy knows how to sell a PPV, much like Tito before him. Until Brock is beaten his hype wont die down, too many people hate him and want to see him lose.

[Guest Michael89]

What was with the subtitles being used for Bisping? That was funny.

[Guest Drake]

What was with the subtitles being used for Bisping? That was funny.

 

Yeah I was laughing at that too. :lol

[Guest Michael89]

Lol, we can't be that bad to not understand our dialects..

[Guest Drake]

Lol, we can't be that bad to not understand our dialects..

 

Don't worry man, Americans tend to do that shit.

 

I mean, in FIFA 09', when you select the audio language options, you get French, English and then you get MEXICAN SPANISH! I mean, WHAT THE ****! :lol

 

Why does it has to be Mexican Spanish and not just plain Spanish? It's not like the say British English also. Gotta love the Americans. :lol

[Guest Jack]

Doubting his legitimacy is for people who see themselves as hardcore fans in the know, but in fact cant be bothered to find out anything. Lesnar was, as you will know as a wrestling fan, a stupidly good wrestler. NCAA champ or some such, so his credentials arent exactly 'guy off the street' lke a lot of people make out.

Yeah, true, but he's hardly what you'd call an experianced fighter, is he? He's got his wrestling....and....? That's it. Wrestling alone is not good enough in MMA and that's what people see as a problem for Brock. Yeah, he was a good wrestler, but you have to go back, what, ten years to find his last amatuer matches? Then he was a pro-wrestler for about seven years, which must have had a negative effect, when you consider the stress on his body and the time away from perfecting his wrestling skills. And even if you assume that there was no negative effect by all that time wasted, I couldn't see even Alexander Karelin going undefeated during PRIDE's best years. Point is, no matter how much one perfects his craft, MMA is more than that and you have to be able to prove you have more than one way to win, which people doubt with Lesnar. Put him in there with a Crocrop or even a Vera and see how he does.

 

It's not hard to see why people would doubt Lesnar. Funnily enough, it's also part of the intrigue though.

I cant see his drawing power going down by much, the guy knows how to sell a PPV, much like Tito before him. Until Brock is beaten his hype wont die down, too many people hate him and want to see him lose.

Tito was actually likeable though, in the same way Floyd Mayweather is. Yeah, you pay so see them get beat but if they win, you don't mind saying "Damn, they're great" and you start to build up the next opponent. With Lesnar, I don't see that same charm that others like Tito and Mayweather have that makes you want to see them get beat, but then keep coming back after they win.

[Paul 584]

Yeah, true, but he's hardly what you'd call an experianced fighter, is he? He's got his wrestling....and....? That's it. Wrestling alone is not good enough in MMA and that's what people see as a problem for Brock.

 

If its not good enough in MMA then why is he beating supposedly top guys with, and I know this is subjective, ease? Stood up or on the ground, he has battered people down and won, why should he start subbing them out when that would be harder for him? Lets be fair, it cant be easy to lock in some of the more intricate moves with arms that size. :lol

 

Besides, a lot of top guys in the past have had 'their' way to end a fight and almost always won like that. For example Liddell was a punchfest son of a bitch.