Films Biggest Anti Hero

[ViciousPrism 177]

Films biggest anti-hero might have to be Light Yagami from the Death Note series. (Lest ye forget that Death Note was made into a live action flick, and spawned two feature length animes).

 

Simply put for those who haven't seen Death Note, Light is a straight-A student who comes across a notebook with powers to kill just by writing a name whilst picturing their face (To stop people with the same name being killed accidentally).

 

At first, his actions seem pure as far as he's killing criminals. But then as the movie (and Anime series) goes on... Ahh, I won't speak of it anymore because you must watch it. (I prefer the anime to the films, but I find the films entertaining too.)

[Omega 354]

For sure, the Greeks loved their tragic heroes.

 

Talking of the Greeks, in the Illiad I can only find one person who stands out as an actual hero, and thats the Trojan prince Hector. I may be the only person who was ever surprised by that. :lol

 

Yeah, I'm going to agree with you because I've not read the full iliad only a synposis. Achilles seems to come across as not so much being some great dissenter about Agamemnon's warring just that he doesn't get his way of things so sulks until Agamemnon begs him to fight and then sends out Patroclus who gets killed and suddenly that's hectors fault! :S

[Paul 584]

Exactly. Hes vain, self obsessed, bad tempered, brutal, lacks any kind of empathy for anyone besides his friend/cousin/lover (depends on how you read it).

 

Hector knows he is fated to die if he faces Achilles, but does so anyway and still refuses to cheat or run.

[Omega 354]

The last bit only makes sense in context. It seems ridiculous to us now to die and be famous rather than live long and be forgotten. The Greeks had a word for it that would make me look really smart if I could remember it. Basically it was that there was a special kind of fame to be achieved from dying in battle....

[Paul 584]

But Hector didnt want fame. He wanted to live with his family in peace, but he fought in order to try to save his family from death or slavery at the hands of the Greeks.

 

Interesting thought, maybe by trying to put his family above his reputation as a warrior he would in fact be their version of an anti hero?

[Omega 354]

Sorry got confused. It's Achilles who has the choice about whether to go home to greece and die old and forgotten or to fight Hector and die young but be remembered forever. I didn't think Hector got the choice?

[Paul 584]

Yes Achillies had that choice, Hector was begged by his wife not to fight but he said he had to in order to protect them.

 

I think we got a bit confused between who was talking about who. :lol

 

 

edit: actually, the film Troy is pretty good where the characters of Hector and Achilles are concerned.

[Omega 354]

It's about the only thing :)

[Guest Jayfunk]

The funny thing about that story is that the horse doesn't apepar in it nor the victory. it appears in something called the mini Illiad

[Maxximus 353]

Eric Bana and Brad Pitt, two of the biggest bad asses on the planet in that movie right there.

 

The Elf guy from LotR is a whiny little bitch though!

[Paul 584]

The funny thing about that story is that the horse doesn't apepar in it nor the victory. it appears in something called the mini Illiad

 

Close, its the Little Illiad.

[Maxximus 353]

I know we're talking movies here, But Dexter from Dexter(the TV show) is a total anti-hero.

[Paul 584]

Dude, we've started discussing epic cycle poetry, I wouldnt worry about TV shows. :lol

[DC 536]

I disagree Draven is a Villian, but only slightly

You couldn't be more wrong. You could try, but you couldn't do it.

we're talking about anti-heros though, not villains. I would say Draven is an anti-hero of sorts. Same as the Punisher, they're both killing bad guys, but they're still killing.

I get that, but Darkstar asked for characters who are portrayed as the good guy throughout the movie, but turn out to be the villain at the end. None of Icon's examples fall into that remit, which is why I said none of them are villains.

[Paul 584]

Except he is a villain, the protagonist can be a villain. He commits acts of torture, arson and murder, hes a villain but for the right reasons.

 

Though hes never portrayed as being different to what he is, its only peoples own interpretations that makes him out as a full hero.

[The Icon 152]

You couldn't be more wrong. You could try, but you couldn't do it.I get that, but Darkstar asked for characters who are portrayed as the good guy throughout the movie, but turn out to be the villain at the end. None of Icon's examples fall into that remit, which is why I said none of them are villains.

 

Not that it is a perfect site, due to the anybody can edit it nature, but Wiki agrees with my pick of Eric Draven as an Antihero. So in general people do think of him as an antihero. Therefore I consider that I was right to call him so.

[DC 536]

Except he is a villain, the protagonist can be a villain. He commits acts of torture, arson and murder, hes a villain but for the right reasons.

 

Though hes never portrayed as being different to what he is, its only peoples own interpretations that makes him out as a full hero.

I never said a protagonist can't be a villian (or vice-versa), but Eric Draven is, for me, not a villain. He does commit acts of violence and murder, but not to innocent people, not just for the sake of doing them.

 

I mean, in Commando, Matrix kills dozens of people, as does John Rambo and most action heroes, but I wouldn't call them villains either. Rorschach from Watchmen kills and tortures people, while also commiting arson, but I wouldn't call him a villain either.

 

In Die Hard, John McClane kills people (firing first a number of times) and commits acts of property destruction. Han Solo famously shoots Greedo first and is a smuggler and a thief, Steven Seagal kills loads of people in his movies and Blade murders humans, tortures humans, commits robbery and is guilty of arson, but, again, I wouldn't consider them villains.

 

The dictionary definition is as follows -:

• 1) a cruelly malicious person who is involved in or devoted to wickedness or crime; scoundrel.
   
   
  
• 2) a character in a play, novel, or the like, who constitutes an important evil agency in the plot.

 

Now, it could be argued that point 1 (the "involved in crime" part) means that Eric Draven is a villain depending on whether you define what he did as being "involved" in crime rather than being a vigilante and perpetrating criminal acts.

 

If you go with the vigilante being a villain (as they - in general -, by proxy of working outside the law, are commiting criminal acts), then that covers a lot of superheroes too.

Not that it is a perfect site, due to the anybody can edit it nature, but Wiki agrees with my pick of Eric Draven as an Antihero. So in general people do think of him as an antihero. Therefore I consider that I was right to call him so.

I wasn't arguing with you in regards to him being an anti-hero, I was disagreeing with your comment he was a villain, which is something completely different.

Draven is a Villian.

Edited January 19, 2011 by DC

[Paul 584]

I never said a protagonist can't be a villian (or vice-versa), but Eric Draven is, for me, not a villain. He does commit acts of violence and murder, but not to innocent people, not just for the sake of doing them.

 

 

Except he does some things just for the sake of them... there was no need for him to force the guy to overdose, he could have just killed him.

 

The dictionary definition is as follows -:

1) a cruelly malicious person who is involved in or devoted to wickedness or crime; scoundrel.

 

Now, it could be argued that point 1 (the "involved in crime" part) means that Eric Draven is a villain depending on whether you define what he did as being "involved" in crime rather than being a vigilante and perpetrating criminal acts.

 

I was thinking more that he tortures someone, he is cruel and is committed to crime as you say.

 

 

If you go with the vigilante being a villain (as they - in general -, by proxy of working outside the law, are commiting criminal acts), then that covers a lot of superheroes too.I wasn't arguing with you in regards to him being an anti-hero, I was disagreeing with your comment he was a villain, which is something completely different.

 

A superhero who is cruel and malicious would certainlly fall into villain for me. Including Punisher. Its just so happened that the villain is on the side of the heroes. Thats what I see as the anti hero...

 

 

 

edit: why are we even bothered? :lol

 

The Crow is certainly an anti hero. He has a lot of traits of the villains. Maybe hes nto a villain, but he matches the profile other than the 'endgame'.

Edited January 19, 2011 by Paul

[King 277]

De Niro in Taxi Driver for me, just the ultimate anti-hero.Another good one is Joe pesci in Casino as Nicky Santoro.

[DC 536]

Except he does some things just for the sake of them... there was no need for him to force the guy to overdose, he could have just killed him.

With that, T-Bird and his boys were killed by what defined them ("live by the sword, die by the sword"); in Funboy's case, this was drugs, so you could say it was justified in context.

edit: why are we even bothered? :lol

Because it's the internet, we're geeks and it's interesting to find out what other people define as being a villain as opposed to someone who does bad things for less-than-bad reasons.

 

One that really tests the theory is Ozymandias and what he does in Watchmen. He does possibly the most terrible act imaginable, but does it for the right reasons and actually achieves what most people want to happen - a (generally) united planet and sense of world peace. The rest of the group deciding to go along with the plan also asks questions about what makes a hero and what makes a villain.